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Slotcar Racer
01-04-2011, 05:23 PM
In my new identity, I am purely a slot car racer. I only post about what I am doing with my slot car racing program. My purpose is to discuss slot car racing as a builder and as a racer. This is about tire wrenches, comm truer, soldering iron, acid flux, axle spacers, guides, cans, magnets, motor spacers....you name it, if it has to do with slot cars, I am on it. I am Slotcar Racer.

Yesterday I worked on three GT12 chassis I am planning to sell on ebay later this month, three Slick 7 "Hybrid" chassis. It's a lot like the Slick 7 GTX except it is a combination of brass and steel. I've tested these chassis before at SCR (my home track, Slot Car Raceway, site of the 2006 and 2008 USRA Scale Nationals) and they ran solid 3.7s, very respectable....and that was with a Red Fox Audi R10. I've reconditioned these three chassis, coated them with dicom where they are steel so they don't rust. All have axle bearings nicely aligned. One chassis will have a Cahoza 40T, another a 41T and the third an angled 42 tooth. Tonight I need to build some motors for these cars, and on Saturday when I am up at SCR racing with NORCAL, I need to pick up some bodies to squirt. I usually run a paint scheme on my own cars of silver front and orange back, but for the cars I sell I like the combination of silver front and Tamiya light blue rear. The blue is really a nice color, and it goes on the lexan really well. Well, I better get back to work.

Slotcar Racer

THE SLOTCAR RACER TODAY INDEX

Pages 1-9 January 2011
Introductory remarks and welcome by several OWH members.

Numarc makes me concentrically ground sharp points on the ends of a 2mm axle to use in a magnetic balancer.

Answers to Pilmat’s question about Bulldog chassis set up, rail sizes, rear steer, etc

Introductory remarks about Proformance Racing, Inc. HOGGER diamond wheel for tire truing.

DYKEM for preventing rust on steel chassis

The NORCAL January race at Slot Car Raceway with 100 entries

Richard Mack 1/24 scale F1/JRL chassis

Koford products for unshunted motors M609 & M608 and Cahoza #255 springs

Slick 7’s “Hybrid GT12” chassis RTR race cars

Preparations for the race at TNT Raceway in Modesto, California

Third Eye Technologies FETroller as used at the Modesto race

Info on the Hakko 936 with the medium-sized 907 handle. A kit to convert the handle from medium to large tips.

A number of questions from Dystyn Wade regarding arm size, airgap and gearing. Some great answers from Andy at AB Slotsport. SCR Q&A on post #98, page 7

Q&A on Hawk motor specs

Cahoza carbon fibre hubs, much discussion

Pictorial tutorial on adjusting the Horky ES24 pan height page 8 post #110

Received Camen single mag 480T X 300L set up

Pages 10-16 February 2011
Building motors with Cahoza parts (yawn)

Difalco controller talk, Bugenis toroid choke for F1 racing

Pat’s prep for the UK32 qualifications

Working on a Tazer prototype, much interest in Tazer thru February

Complaint about 70 degree heat in the Bay Area, 24 temp records broken in one day

Cahoza 42T 16 deg spurs and various pinions, how they mesh

Motor/gearing experiments, Cahoza set ups at .530” and 8T pinion

Eurosport arms, lifting stack corners

Race report from SCR 2/14/11, Eurosport & GT12

Preparation for NORCAL race at TNT Raceway…gluing donuts and HOGGER

New Horky ES24 build, 3.1s at SCR

Tire building Q&A with Zippity

The passing of Rob McQuiston

16D info from Monty Ohren

Pages 17-27 March 2011
Pages 28-35 April 2011
Pages 36-45 May 2011
Pages 46-56 June 2011
Pages 57-69 July 2011
Pages 70-79 August 2011
Pages 80-89 September 2011
Pages 90-97 October 2011
Pages 98-110 Novemeber 2011
Pages 111-121 December 2011

Big Mike1
01-04-2011, 05:35 PM
WOW George you really know what this forum is suppose to be about not beating the dead horse that has been beaten to a pulp then cremated and now is being beaten again GREAT TO SEE SOMEONE HAS DECIDED TO USE THE BOARD FOR WHAT IT WAS ANTICIPATED! Now im going to go tear down some 27lite motors to have rebalanced and build a couple new box 12 chassis to put in the counter. What an inspiration wish i didnt have to work all day so i to could just play with toy cars. Please pass the cheetos

fxgeorge
01-04-2011, 07:32 PM
Who is this Slotcar Racer anyway?

Slotcar Racer
01-04-2011, 07:34 PM
Glad you are enjoying it Mike. Tell me about your 27 lite motors. Who do you use for balancing? You're building a couple of box 12 chassis for the counter, are you a track owner, or do you build RTRs for a local track? I know what you mean about work versus play. I had eleven days off from work and worked on slot cars for hours and hours. Like the Worlds in Chicago....set up pit space Saturday Sept 25th, take down pit space Oct 10th....work on slot cars all day from Sept 25-Oct 10. It's the most fun I've had in years. Some could say, "you have no life". I beg to disagree. If you are passionate about ANYTHING, you are doing better than most people. Well, I gotta get back to work and grab some more Cheetos.

MentalKase
01-04-2011, 08:02 PM
How did you get Paul to allow you an alter ego? (You send him Viagra CHeetos to the Phillipines?)

Big Mike1
01-04-2011, 08:06 PM
I use a secret balancer for all my arms and i build a lot of rtr cars for racers at my raceway I just got home from the raceway and now its time to box these arms up and ship them out to lee, then spend some time with the wife and kids my 5 year old who races too lost two teeth in the last 24 hours I think the tooth fairy is going to go broke. But now he has money to spend on some new slot car parts lol. Pass the cheetos back.

Wallbasher
01-04-2011, 08:41 PM
Hey Mike What do teeth go for these days? Did I get ripped off when I only got a quarter?

pilmat
01-05-2011, 05:37 AM
George, from the photo of your Mack BD from the 2010 USRA Nats, it looks like you have soldered the rails in the rear. As you have also narrowed the pan side play, was the solid rear steer also to tighten the car?

I've just built a BD2 and a Tazer and amazed in the increased rear bite on the Tazer.

Cheers.

Frankie
01-05-2011, 06:36 AM
Hey Mike What do teeth go for these days? Did I get ripped off when I only got a quarter?

Yep...You got screwed.. My kids always got a $1.00. Your parents probably didn't like you, so when you lost a tooth they gave you a quarter and then gave your brother your other 75 cents.

dhamby
01-05-2011, 09:32 AM
ill take the cheetos . last night when i got home i went to my slot car room the room that house,s the heat pump noisy but like im in a diff. world . i worked on 4 cars for tonights race i installed the last 2 slick 7 chassis braces my track had that i bought into 1 turbo chassis and another one into a astro chassis and then i put new tires on another car and took the tires that where on that car and trued them up and put on a wedge car that has a super 16d in it also checked all the cars for axle play and adjusted them . oiled every car up and packed up for tonights race . i keep up 3 cars every week one for myself one that my g-f races and the othere one that my dad races. i got in the ole bed about 2am and was at wrk at 9am but its all worth it when we get to the track and myself my dad and my g-f all have cars all ready to go .. also this week i built my first brake box for my koford 558 controller ... and to my first sentence yes i still run astro chassis at my track they are heavy but take a beating and really hold up on our track (76ft modi. paper clip) . ok the bag of cheetos are empty so i bought a new bag who wants them >>??

Slotcar Racer
01-05-2011, 09:34 AM
Wish I had gotten more done last night. NuMarc, God Bless that man, sent me a new 2mm axle for balancing wheels. NuMarc is SCR's resident machinist. He concentrically ground sharp points on the ends of a 2mm axle to use in a magnetic balancer. Right now I am borrowing Alan Ohashi's, but I have one on order from Dave Harvey, Won O Won in UK. Dave sells a balancer and he tricks it out with microscope lenses covering the magnets, that way the pointed tip of the axle is against glass and less resistance. PG (Paul Gawronski) showed me how he grinds his wheels and balances the wheel by itself. With what little I have done with this, I have balanced the entire tire...hub, glue, rubber....and use very small pieces of blue masking tape as weight. It's pretty amazing that just a small patch of masking tape can make such a big difference, but estimating the rear axle speed of a eurosport at about 15,000 rpm, it makes a huge difference.

Gotta mount some donuts tonight for NORCAL on Saturday, a bit low on 3/32" tires.

Slotcar Racer
01-05-2011, 09:37 AM
George, from the photo of your Mack BD from the 2010 USRA Nats, it looks like you have soldered the rails in the rear. As you have also narrowed the pan side play, was the solid rear steer also to tighten the car?

I've just built a BD2 and a Tazer and amazed in the increased rear bite on the Tazer.

Cheers.

Hi Phil, yes, I use .047" rails and solder it all solid. That's just my driving style and works for me. I know others employ rear steer. My first BD was for the last Cobalt 12 race at the 09 Scale Nats, the chassis was built with .032" wire with rear steer...worked great (won the race). I then put a G12 C Can motor in it. It was awful. Try different set ups, that's the cool thing about Richard's products.

topkat
01-05-2011, 10:19 AM
Sitting in my car ,driving and thinking, I realized that I missed putting in the work to build and tune in a proper race car whether it be a Womp, Retro or Eurosport. I was for a while content with bringing a subpar car and tune it to be ok. Hanging out with my friends and just plain schmoozing had taken precedence. I really missed the podium celebrations and the victories that came with it. No matter what else is said we are all racing for that win. We are now in a new year so I have a new attitude and am “branding “ myself a little different. See youz at the Checkpoint

team burrito
01-05-2011, 11:08 AM
WOW George you really know what this forum is suppose to be about not beating the dead horse that has been beaten to a pulp then cremated and now is being beaten again. You forgot puree.

Slotcar Racer
01-06-2011, 09:32 AM
Thanks for that Russ. Working on slotcars last night was quite brief, but fruitful. I went through all my Speedshop 3/32" hubs to check for run out AKA wobble. I'd say only about half of what I had were any where near true. This is from the bag full of hubs from The Flat Track Worlds last summer. I managed to find 8 pairs of hubs that were really good and glued them. Went to the refrigerator and looked through the bags of donuts and found some Piranhas I got from Paul last summer. This batch was pretty sticky according to my notes, so I glued up 8 pairs, let all this set for about an hour, then went to the garage for the stinky part....dip in lacquer thinner and join together. Wife hates the smell of the thinner, can't blame her. So, I left those in the garage and will drill the set screw holes tonight. Tomorrow night I can start grinding and truing.

Sent Dave Harvey an email letting him know the 25t25 Valiko I ordered from him before Xmas still isn't here. Dave replied this morning that stuff from the Czech Republic is late too, and mailing around the holidays always makes him nervous. Dave's a great vendor. Hopefully armature in mail today. Gotta go, time to get to "work".

KVAN
01-06-2011, 09:50 AM
Slotcar Racer, with all that heavy prep work, how do you find time for fishing?

patraceruk
01-06-2011, 11:12 AM
Hi Slot car racer.

I imagine you wear a mask and a cloak and leave copies of a Uk magazine as your calling card at every track you raid. Although with your waist line wearing the underpants over your tights must be a sight for sore eyes.

So you race at SCR? I hate it when people post from California as I struggle through a scottish winter. No doubt after a suucessfull raid you get in your woody van and head to the beach with your surfboard having changed from your cunning disguise into a pair of flip flops and long shorts and a Worlds tee shirt and of course a cool pair of raybands.

When your next at SCR give my regards to George and Paul.

Well I've got to get back to my freezing cold workshop in the attic and finish off my 1/24 Richard mack anglewinder F1 chassis. My mission this year is to convert uk racers to this calss of racing. Can you ask George what motor he uses for this class the next time you see him.

Pat

Slotcar Racer
01-06-2011, 01:06 PM
Slotcar Racer, with all that heavy prep work, how do you find time for fishing?

Slotcar Racer prepares slot cars with full attention to detail, except at The Worlds. A slotcar is only as good as the sum of CORRECTLY assembled parts. KVAN, I want you to remember that the next time you think you have finished prepping a slotcar and then head for the closet and grab your fishing pole. I am Slotcar Racer.

Slotcar Racer
01-06-2011, 01:12 PM
Hi Slot car racer.

I imagine you wear a mask and a cloak and leave copies of a Uk magazine as your calling card at every track you raid. Although with your waist line wearing the underpants over your tights must be a sight for sore eyes.

Hello Pat, you are partially correct. I do manage to keep the waistline on the correct side of the underpants (is this too much information?) however I do not recommend letting women and children watch me race.

So you race at SCR?

There have been SCR sitings.

I hate it when people post from California as I struggle through a scottish winter.

Sorry to hear that. I better finish this message quickly, only 40 minutes left in my lunch hour so I can go out for a nice walk through the campus wearing just my shirt....

No doubt after a suucessfull raid you get in your woody van and head to the beach with your surfboard having changed from your cunning disguise into a pair of flip flops and long shorts and a Worlds tee shirt and of course a cool pair of raybands.

OK, did somebody get pictures of all this? Only me and "Surfer Dude" Tim Hould have been known to take off our disguises. No, wait, Tim you don't where a disguise, do you? Mike Who?

When your next at SCR give my regards to George and Paul.

They rarely talk to me, they know I am busy CAREFULLY prepping my slotcars....except at The Worlds

Well I've got to get back to my freezing cold workshop in the attic and finish off my 1/24 Richard mack anglewinder F1 chassis. My mission this year is to convert uk racers to this calss of racing. Can you ask George what motor he uses for this class the next time you see him.

I'll have George email you the details. Thanks Pat

Pat

Oh, Pat, one more thing, what motors are you running in those 1/24 F1s?

patraceruk
01-06-2011, 03:31 PM
Thinking of using Horky 12 mag 18/24!

Big Mike1
01-06-2011, 04:25 PM
Hey Mike What do teeth go for these days? Did I get ripped off when I only got a quarter?
you got really screwed all of my son's teeth have gone for 5 bucks each, and my daughter lost one a year or so ago and got 20 for it

pilmat
01-07-2011, 05:48 AM
Road Trip! Piling the stuff in the car for a trek down to Lou's Grand Prix Model Raceway tonight and then off to The Race Place, NJ tomorrow for my first ISRA NE event. Yee-haw!!!!

Hope I get to try the new .540 X12 arm I got from James...

Slotcar Racer
01-07-2011, 09:22 AM
Last night I pulled THE HOGGER off the shelf. That's the super rough diamond drum Liebenthal manufactures from his Proformance Racing, Inc. These super rough drums became available late last summer. David makes a regular drum (like the Czech one that has been available for some time), a medium drum (Hermanator picked up one of those and loves it) and I have THE HOGGER which is the most coarse drum. I switched out drums from my Hudy tire truer...normally I keep the regular grade drum in it. The switch is very easy, most of the work is cleaning the machine before taking it apart...a sort of enforced cleaning program.

So I had eight pairs of 3/32" hub tires to grind down from raw donuts. First step was taking a nice fresh Xacto blade and slicing off the excess rubber from the sides. That took about 15 minutes. I only screwed up one...cut in too far. I hate that. That one is a practice tire now. After the sides are trimmed, time to put THE HOGGER to use. Turn up the Hudy a little higher voltage than usual, 6 volts, and then just let it rip. It takes only about 20 seconds to take it from a rough donut down to .690". I have a table with a rectangular hole cut in it and a frame where the tire truer fits....the rectangular hole in the tire truer positioned over the hole in the table. Below the table is just a cardboard box....the rubber dust falls like crazy. After only about 25 minutes I have all eight pairs down to .690".

I'm going to let them sit like that until I get to SCR tomorrow where I will use the regular drum to finish off the tires to whatever I need, usually between .650" - .670" gives me .032" clearance.

Tomorrow is LMP and GT12 on the famed Testarossa at Slot Car Raceway. CRASH is saving pit space for me, I plan to come up after the banked track racing.....probably later in the afternoon. OK, gotta go now, back to "work".

patraceruk
01-08-2011, 02:18 AM
Slot Car Racer
I'm surprised you weren't arrested for only wearing a shirt. Guess what just as I received your reply we had another 2 inches of snow!

What is Dicom? Richard and I have looking for something to stop rusting for ages.

Pat

Slotcar Racer
01-08-2011, 10:16 AM
What is Dicom? Richard and I have looking for something to stop rusting for ages.

Pat

Pat, I think I spelled it wrong. All it is is armature dye, like Lucky Bob's arm dye. If you apply it to these bare steel chassis, it greatly protects from oxidation....same reason we apply dye to an armature, to keep it from rusting. Why do we prevent bare steel armature stacks from rusting but not the chassis? You might give it a try.

Right now, Slotcar Racer is packing for the race today. Finished the 8 pairs of 3/32" tires, so I will have plenty to choose from. I'm not sure how competitive the cars will be today, particularly the LMP (flexi with Koford Competitor motor), but when the race starts, all I can hope for is wring everything I can out of the car and try to miss as many wrecks as possible. The organization I am participating in today does not qualify for semis and/or mains. It is always run as a huge double (out after white AND purple) round robin rotation. The races are well run, however racing in the traffic is the most challenging I have ever encountered. Race report will follow....gotta go.

Slotcar Racer
01-09-2011, 10:35 AM
Yesterday's NORCAL Slot Car Racing Assn race was their best attendance of the season so far, well over 100 entries for four classes. Slotcar Racer raced the two classes on the Testarossa road course, LMP and GT12. I wasn't expecting great results with the cars I brought although both the LMP and the GT12 chassis had won multiple races. The motor rules for this series are much less sophisticated than many of the series discussed on this forum. For C Cans the largest arm diameter is .518", and they have devised a special device to police this at tech inspection, some little electronic looking gadget with a green light. No shunts and insulation on the brushes. It pretty much points out that it is more difficult to go from .540 arms with shunts back 2-3 years to the smaller arms, and take off the shunts. But, the regulars in this series have found ways to make these motors really fast....so much easier for them to go the other direction (add shunts and large arms) I think. Therefore, I am very impressed!

My motors for both classes were definitely underpowered. The chassis were great as usual, Cheetah 11 with 030 center, 025 outers and a body that created a few double takes....JK Products BMW. GT12 was my old faithful Trench Car recently rebuilt and really smooth...it's the 2009 Mack Bulldog that I won the last Cobalt 12 Eurosport championship with.

Both motors were Cahoza UL cans and Koford magnets (shorter version) honed to 535, and both motors used Koford arms at 40 degrees (Competitor for LMP). Both geared 8:40.

Results: 3rd in LMP, 2nd in GT12. Chris Chakires left us in the dust in LMP, won by 19 laps over local friend racer Ryan McDaniel, Ryan beat me by 2-3 laps. Ryan won the GT12 race by a wide margin, his car turning consistent sub 4 second laps...I had trouble even breaking 4 seconds at best. I would say in both races I did a better than average job of avoiding wreckage and wringing everything I could out of subpar motors. Back to the drawing board before I race in NORCAL again, I need to find a lot more horsepower.

Howard Smith had some good results yesterday, and after the races I borrowed Fred Hood's Third Eye Gold Crown and tried it out with my Horky eurosport. There was too much rubber on the track, but I still managed low 3.1s, AND I liked the feel of this controller. Then Howard hooked up the FET controller and it felt very different. I only tried these two controllers for the first time for perhaps 15 minutes, but I am going to get a hold of a demo FET and play with it. Howard only lives a few minutes from the track, so we'll get together again, I have many questions.

Fred, Howard and I then went to the Black Bear Diner where Howard ordered a massive door stop of bread pudding. Fred and I ordered the "sane portion" of tri tip with mashed potatoes and veggies. The minestrone soup was decent, and the coffee was quite good. The meal was a nice topper to the long race day. Fred's motor home blew it's engine, so he had driven up from Fresno in the Go Kart and stayed at Howard's. Next Saturday is a NORCAL "test race" at the new TNT Raceway in Modesto, I'm going to try to get out there, maybe even prepare a 4" NASCAR!!!! We were there before in November to do a chassis/motor building clinic and only ran 15 minutes on the Corkscrew...what a COOL track. Oh, gotta go, time to do the weekly food shopping.

Big Mike1
01-09-2011, 02:17 PM
Good turnout yesterday at skidmarks in flint mi for a exciting day of racing, we raced one motor gp12, pro box, I15, and 27's day started out as the race went from 8 cars to 4 in the first heat but by the I15 race the racers had calmed down and uncle spove came out with the win usuing only 1 motor and Dave w was close behind in second then, now on to 27's it was my race until the 6th heat when i lost a endbell bearing and had to go to the third motor and change a gear, but thats racing and sponge bob won with larry langdon came in second,jeff got third and i ended up in fourth.

Then there was 11 of us who went to dinner and had some good talk about the div.1 nats this year at chicks hobbiz in va. looks as if at least 8 michigan racers as of now will be attending thats up 6 from last year. Now its time to go get some motors tore down and shipped out for balancing so i can have them ready for the 22nd at TR Motorplex.

Slotcar Racer
01-10-2011, 09:32 AM
Thanks for that update Mike, it's always good to hear about a day of slotcar racing even if you lose half the field in only the first heat!!! Of course the dinner out after the race is what it's all about. You're going to love that King track at Chick's, it is incredible.

I pulled the motors from Saturday's race cars and removed the pinions. Didn't get to rebuilding them yet because I need to rethink my whole NORCAL motor program. I seem to be faster than about 22 guys, but there are 2-3 others who have monster motors I just can't keep up with. There was good timing when I got an email from Jim Radford up in Seattle, he just got in a large shipment of BOW motors and armatures. I ordered a couple of G12 arms at 45 degrees and they had a 46 degree Contender....these are all .516" diameter so legal for NORCAL C Cans. I think I will also need to install some new T5 magnets for these three armatures and then I might have something for my 2-3 racer friends in NORCAL.

There's a NORCAL practice race at TNT Raceway this coming Saturday. I'm thinking 6T pinion on my GT12 for the Corkscrew!

team burrito
01-10-2011, 11:10 AM
is them BOW motors still legal for NorCal?

patraceruk
01-10-2011, 12:06 PM
Sounds like you had a great days racing Slot Car Racer. Over 100 entries is seriously good. Wow!!!

Finished the Mack 24th F1 yesterday. Installed a BSP prepared super wasp c can I had kicking around my workshop. Hope to try it out later this week. An article on the build will be in the next issue of SCRN

Images attached

Mic Byrd
01-10-2011, 12:27 PM
Pat
Have F1 Mack very nice chassis .1 thing the front wheel stand offs don't take a hit . lent it to a buddy late in the race a car came off if front of him and it took off left front wheel. I have since rebuilt it and reinforced those 2 stand offs. Nice Build by the way

Slotcar Racer
01-10-2011, 01:22 PM
Yeah Pat, it looks really nice, good job building my friend. Hey, thanks so much for that bottle of scotch you gave me at The Worlds. I still haven't opened it!!!! What's the matter with me? Mic, if you lived closer, I'd have you over to the house to make sure I open that bottle!!!!!

Mic Byrd
01-10-2011, 01:37 PM
Slotcar Racer
Years ago I would have flown across country to have a glass with you. Don't indulge in it anymore . Have a tazer thread started any insight would be welcome.

Mic Byrd
01-10-2011, 01:48 PM
Slotcar Racer
you mite want to look at these Koford products for those unshunted contender motors M609 & M608 I use them on 16 D motors with good success .Springs only seem good for a race or two.

Slotcar Racer
01-11-2011, 09:12 AM
Thanks Mic, I'll check out those Koford items and also look at the Tazer thread. I'll bring the scotch to the race in Modesto this Saturday to share with Fred Hood. So, last night one of those nights to just do the necessary "busy work". Opened up the set screw holes in the rubber on five pairs of tires so I could easily pull out the defective set screws. I had made up a bunch of these tires on new magnesium hubs, but the screws were stripping the hubs. These are the longer solid set screws....I've never had problems with the short hollow screws. So, I switched out set screws and trued these last tires down to .680" for Saturday. I need to call Paul to order another 100 set screws. I think I am getting tired of only 50% of these magnesium hubs being anywhere near true. Over the years at least half of them are really wobbly. Once the rubber is mounted and trued, they work OK for practice tires, but for race tires, Slotcar Racer prefers something with very little run out. Will have to look into the carbon fibre hubs and the Cahoza hubs. Really pricey, but I hear they are accurate. OK, gotta go, "work" is calling.

mazur50
01-11-2011, 03:47 PM
Slotcar Racer
you mite want to look at these Koford products for those unshunted contender motors M609 & M608 I use them on 16 D motors with good success .Springs only seem good for a race or two.

The springs are a bit on the light side and do not hold up to heat well.

I ran them on a 16D that I had and found that the car slowed down. But give them a try you mileage may vary.

Roger has two cards of them if you want to give them a try a long with cups.

Mike

Mic Byrd
01-11-2011, 03:53 PM
Mike your right they are lite but you can tweak them and they don't last much more then a race.But I've had some real good group 10 motors useing them .

mazur50
01-11-2011, 03:55 PM
Mike your right they are lite but you can tweak them and they don't last much more then a race.But I've had some real good group 10 motors useing them .

I agree any thing you can use to get the power the brush the better.

MantaRay
01-11-2011, 04:22 PM
BTW.........DYKEM is the name.........it's main purpose is to lay out metal to be scribed/cut in the machine tool business. just Google it.........it is relatively cheap for a large bottle

backintheslot
01-11-2011, 10:32 PM
Slot car racer,

I thoroughly enjoy the technical aspect that you have injected in to this thread along with the humorous banter.

It is refreshing to read of a racers day to day preparation with an honest attention to detail that is beyond reproach.

As an up and coming racer with a thirst for knowledge and looking for every wee bit of additional speed, If you do not mind, Could you please explain the drive train balancing process and what devices are preferred to do so?

I understand the concept and would like to learn the process.

Thank you slot car racer, Whom ever you are!;)

P.S.........Big boys "Love" scotch....(and single malt Irish too!).... Maybe we should compare notes sometime...........Got flask?:p

Slotcar Racer
01-12-2011, 10:59 AM
Finally got my friend Ken’s high downforce Outisight Mercedes mounted on his new Bulldog 2 GT12. Gorgeous paint job by SCR's Frank Sarkela, really nice! I wish I could build cars as nicely for myself as I do for others. It’s almost without fail that I build a car that beats me, and Ken is a formidable racer at Slot Car Raceway, Rohnert Park, CA, site of the 2006 & 2008 USRA Scale Nats. Ken bought a blueprinted Cahoza G12 motor for this car and how sweet it is. I also finally finished building three other GT12s for future sale. These are Slick 7’s “Hybrid GT12” chassis that came out in the summer of 2009, all with bearings on the rear axle and 72 pitch gears. One has the Cahoza O Can with Tornado 2 mags at a .530” airgap, Koford G12 arm balanced by Alpha, fully shunted. Next is a Kelly 4 hole with Koford mags at .535”, Koford G12 arm balanced by Beuf, and the third is a Kelly 3 hole with Tornado 5 mags and once again, Koford G12 by Beuf. I’ve run this chassis before at SCR and could turn 3.7s easily. One time Rudy and Owl Chump were there testing this chassis and Rudy was clocking in 3.7s. He kind of blew my mind how fast he was going. We were using some of Owl’s monster Box 12 motors, big old hairy Camen cans. I better go now, “work” today is actually work.

<a href="http://www.flickr.com/photos/56038309@N08/5348261322/" title="DSCN3990 by svtgeorge, on Flickr"><img src="http://farm6.static.flickr.com/5246/5348261322_9f62a2e2e4.jpg" width="500" height="375" alt="DSCN3990" /></a>

Mic Byrd
01-12-2011, 11:27 AM
Slotcar Racer
Top Notch work .I like the Dykem die hate to clean rust .solid pin tubes do you float them and what do they do for you that way?

Slotcar Racer
01-12-2011, 06:41 PM
Thanks a lot Mic, I appreciate it. Also many thanks to Curmudgeon for giving me the correct name for Dykem, I will definitely look it up. I wonder if that works better than the comm dye. My buddy Fred Hood has used the comm dye for years, so I started using it when all these unplated chassis started appearing. On the floating pins tubes, Rudy designed them really well, the holes are nice and big so they really shake rattle and roll like they should. Also, the front mount is WAY up front, gives really good downforce from the front of the body. The Hybrid chassis is pretty much the same as the Slick 7 GTX only it has brass and steel which Rudy says does something with harmonic vibrations. When he started talking about that stuff I knew it was going way above my head so I just asked him to pass the salt when we were eating at Black Bear Diner. Owl chowed down on a huge plate of strawberry belgian waffles as I recall. That man can pack away a lot of food for such a skinny bean pole.

mazur50
01-12-2011, 07:43 PM
Armature dye is just a thinned out version of dykem. But I am not sure what they use to thin it.

Ken Swanson
01-12-2011, 11:18 PM
Sounds like you had a great days racing Slot Car Racer. Over 100 entries is seriously good. Wow!!!

Finished the Mack 24th F1 yesterday. Installed a BSP prepared super wasp c can I had kicking around my workshop. Hope to try it out later this week. An article on the build will be in the next issue of SCRN

Images attached

Great looking car. If you don't mind me asking, what did you use to wrap the front axle stubs with?

Thanks

oldweirdherald
01-12-2011, 11:55 PM
Armature dye is just a thinned out version of dykem. But I am not sure what they use to thin it.

Scotch... but not in the dykem. :p

Slapshot
01-13-2011, 01:19 AM
Scotch... but not in the dykem. :p

Acetone int he Dykem but not in Pauls Scotch and don't confuse that with Laquer Thinner as that wont work, in either the Scotch or the Dykem

Raymond

Jeff714
01-13-2011, 06:12 AM
Have been using the Koford M609, N608 cup spring combination for awhile now with very good success. Spring tention hasn't been a problem yet. The cups work well with the Cahoza CAH-255 springs if you want a little more tention.

patraceruk
01-13-2011, 07:22 AM
Hi Ken
I used good old fashioned electrical fuse wire. It's a bit thicker than I would have liked. Must get what ever Richard uses the next time I see him.
Pat

KVAN
01-13-2011, 07:56 AM
Ken,

What Pat said! It comes in all the different wire gauges, you can get it from most electronic stores. Fry's would be a good place for you to look locally.

cbr345
01-13-2011, 12:43 PM
Ken,

You can also use the wire from an old armature.

chris

Slotcar Racer
01-13-2011, 01:38 PM
Short one today. Let the photo suffice to say I have a lot of work to do the next two nights. Unofficial NORCAL race at the new TNT Raceway in Modesto on Saturday, I'd like to get these bow wows loaded into my Cahoza UL/Koford set ups. In the words of Jim Radford, "these are unobtainium"....I'm just glad Jim had them in stock!!! Gotta go

<a href="http://www.flickr.com/photos/56038309@N08/5350293437/" title="DSCN3992 by svtgeorge, on Flickr"><img src="http://farm6.static.flickr.com/5088/5350293437_29091cba16.jpg" width="500" height="375" alt="DSCN3992" /></a>

MantaRay
01-13-2011, 03:20 PM
All I can say after seeing the picture, is, DUCK

Get Busy

Slotcar Racer
01-14-2011, 09:19 AM
Finally started to prepare for the race at TNT Raceway in Modesto, California which is tomorrow. I found a perfectly OK JK Products Toyota to mount on my NASCAR, but had to glue up some big hubs tires just in time. They really should cure for a minimum of 24 hours, so I should be able to cut them tonight. I pulled the 8T pinion off the GT12 (good for SCR's super speedway road course) and put on a 7T for TNT's famed Corkscrew. If I have time tonight, I might load the BOW Contender into the Kelly 3 holes set up I ran in LMP last Saturday....the switch shouldn't take too long. Tomorrow I won't really have time to learn the two tracks, so it will be learn while racing. The hillclimb doesn't look bad, although I am concerned about visibility at the end of the lower straightaway while racing on the right side driver's panel....that could be a blind wreck zone, but we'll take a second look tomorrow. I was only at the track once and maybe 20 minutes on the Corkscrew. I ran a bit on yellow and that was a good lane, then moved to white and it was considerably trickier...but only 5 minutes on that one. Anyway, this is a non-points NORCAL race, pretty much a shake down run for the raceway, make sure everything works well. Results to follow. Gotta go now....

"Dub" Wade
01-14-2011, 10:23 AM
Have fun George. Corkscrew looks challenging

Slotcar Racer
01-14-2011, 01:40 PM
Thanks Wade...yes, it is pretty technical allright.

Slotcar Racer
01-15-2011, 08:52 PM
Saturday, January 15, 2011. Just back from TNT Raceway in Modesto, CA. First a big thanks for our hosts, Roy and Anne, a real first class operation. The store is clean and well run and it feels good to be there. As for the slotcar racing, today was a "shake down" practice race for the NSCRA ("Norcal") series race at TNT in March of this year. The facility worked perfectly today in terms of the tracks, computer system and power for the tracks. The local turnout was very good today, not so many regular Norcal racers. I do wonder a bit how we will all fit into this store when we have the regular series race, but I'm sure the hosts will find a way to accomodate all the racers.

For me today, this was purely a practice session the first time racing on these tracks. Late last year, Fred and I spent maybe 15 minutes on the Hillclimb, and 15 on the Corkscrew. That first practice left me with the impression the Corkscrew is not an easy track to learn, but the Hillclimb is not too bad. Today I raced the 4" NASCAR class, not my usual style of racing, but it's fun to do something different on a banked track. I do like that little Hillclimb. It has some very fast sections and full punch curves, however many of the curves are pretty flat and you have to be patient with them. I think I came in 5th in that race and Fred won.

After lunch we moved over to the Corkscrew for the LMP (Flexi with Contender/Super Wasp) body class. I was in the first heat on blue and when the power came on, all hell broke loose!!! It was pretty goofy, kind of like watching a cartoon at double speed on a small TV screen. After a heat or two, the field settled down and we found the tiny track races really nicely. Monty Ohren and Greg Gilbert, my hats off to you gentlemen for designing this gem. Unfortunately, Slotcar Racer DNF'd....I reached my maximum self imposed limit of three spur gears. I know the motor moved the first time, but I took plenty of time remounting it so I could at least go out and get more practice on the track. But then I blew two more gears and the only thing I can figure out at this point is the rear bushings may be worn out. Otherwise, hard to figure out what happened. I need to figure it out though, I haven't had this kind of mechanical failure in a few years. Oh yeah, Fred won this one too.

Final race of the day GT12 went a lot better for everybody...those HD bodies really help!!! My car was pretty good, just the same thing I ran last week in the regular NORCAL race. I did end up 3rd place in this one although I came off on my own countless times....indicator I don't know the track very well. My only claim to fame today was fast time on the Corkscrew of 3.339....whoopee.....oh yeah, Fred won this one too. Fred won all three!!! That old codger is fast.

Oh, one more thing in hindsight, Howard loaned me a demo controller, a FETroller. I figured I didn't know the tracks, so I may as well try a new controller. I wish my logic had been thought out a little more, but I just wanted to run this controller. It's really nice, and the sensitivity control fills in the gaps missing on my Speedshop controllers.

Tomorrow heading up to SCR to test the FETroller some more, this time with F1 eurosport, 32 Euro and 24 Euro. I better go wash the dishes now...

Jeff714
01-16-2011, 09:01 AM
I've been using the FETroller for several weeks now and could not be happier with it! So far I haven't found anything it doesn't do well. The adjustably range is very impressive.

The way Howard has setup the FTB is very cool! In a race last week I was using about 30% choke with the FTB on. The car coming out of the curves and stayed very stable when the bypass came on. No hard bang! Very cool and drivable feature!

Look forward to hearing more of your thoughts later today on the FETroller.

team burrito
01-17-2011, 07:25 PM
Slot Car Racer, i need your help. I recently bought a Hakko 936 from Fry's, but it came with the medium-sized 907 handle. They do make a kit to convert the handle from medium to large tips. My question is it worth converting the handle or is it fine the way it is?

GearBear
01-17-2011, 07:34 PM
Russ,

I have the 936/907 and it is a little on the lite duty side for chassis work and mounting motors. I would definitely put the heavier tip in. I also have the 900 handle with the conversion to the large tip. It is what I use 98% of the time. I DO like using the 907 for wires and stuff as the smaller tip gets into places so much easier.

907 to 908 Conversion kit (http://www.hakkousa.com/detail.asp?PID=1171&Page=1)

George, I'll try giving you a call on my way home ;)

Slotcar Racer
01-17-2011, 08:29 PM
Slot Car Racer, i need your help. I recently bought a Hakko 936 from Fry's, but it came with the medium-sized 907 handle. They do make a kit to convert the handle from medium to large tips. My question is it worth converting the handle or is it fine the way it is?

Russ Toy, you are my tool mentor, I am flattered you would ask Slotcar Racer such a question. The wise words of Russ Toy, "there's nothing better than the right tool". So, my friend, I can only tell you that you must follow your expertise as the Grand Toolmeister you are. If the 907 handle works and feels right, then stick to it. I'm kind of confused though...it sounds like Fry's sold you the wrong handle with the soldering station you bought? Is it supposed to be that way? By the way, how many watts is that 936? I don't know if you remember the soldering station we used at Fastrax 11 years ago, that was a Hakko 926, I still have it. Nothing beats a Hakko. That reminds me, I need to turn mine back on, dinner hour is over, time to get back to work. Gotta solder the 4 hole Kelly into the all steel Hybrid. Two Slick 7 Hybrids sold, one to go! Better get going.

Slotcar Racer
01-17-2011, 08:32 PM
Russ,

I have the 936/907 and it is a little on the lite duty side for chassis work and mounting motors. I would definitely put the heavier tip in. I also have the 900 handle with the conversion to the large tip. It is what I use 98% of the time. I DO like using the 907 for wires and stuff as the smaller tip gets into places so much easier.

907 to 908 Conversion kit (http://www.hakkousa.com/detail.asp?PID=1171&Page=1)

George, I'll try giving you a call on my way home ;)

Thanks for helping my friend Russ GearBear. Great tip, I had forgotten those Hakko tips were switchable. Around $18 is pretty reasonable I'd say, and Russ does a lot of chassis work. A lot. Get it Russ. Phone's on Gary, hope to hear from you soon. Slotcar Racer, over and out.

Slotcar Racer
01-17-2011, 08:58 PM
I've been using the FETroller for several weeks now and could not be happier with it! So far I haven't found anything it doesn't do well. The adjustably range is very impressive.

The way Howard has setup the FTB is very cool! In a race last week I was using about 30% choke with the FTB on. The car coming out of the curves and stayed very stable when the bypass came on. No hard bang! Very cool and drivable feature!

Look forward to hearing more of your thoughts later today on the FETroller.

Jeff, I just didn't have enough time to really assess Howard's troller, the FET. I got to SCR at 3:45 and Frank closed at 5:00. I did a number of 3.0 second laps with my Horky eurosport using the FET (that's a great lap time), but it felt very, very different from my Speedshop. I had a lot more trouble using it when I pulled out my F1 Eurosport. Tried the choke and it was so different, I couldn't figure it out in a short amount of time. Like with any new controller, you really have to commit to it, race it, practice with it, and basically MARRY IT! One thing I really like about the FET is the wide variance in sensitivity. The main problem I've had with the Speedshop is the huge missing gap in sensitivity settings when using the "hi-lo" switch....with the switch on and sensitivity pot all the way down, it's too sensitive. With the switch off and sensivity pot all the way up, not sensitive enough...there's a gap. Maybe Howard can fix that problem. Anyway, I just need more time to assess it Jeff, but I'll keep ya posted.

Slotcar Racer
01-18-2011, 06:43 PM
Tonight I just need to finish up GT12 #3. This one is the all steel Slick 7 Hybrid prototype....being all steel I guess it really isn't exactly a hybrid. It has the Kelly 4 hole with the Koford magnets bored out to .535" and a Beuf balanced Koford G12 arm. Mounting the Outisight Mercedes. Also got my new Valiko 25t25 arm with .250" stack length....it's gonna go into one of my bulked up Gulliver set ups after I bore it out to .490"....then it goes into my 32 Euro I ran at the Worlds. Might get that done in the next few daze, I mean days.

Slotcar Racer
01-19-2011, 09:21 PM
I had four set ups to hone this evening for my buddy Ken Coleman, racer extraordinaire. Opened the Makita case and removed the very old rechargeable drill. Two Pro Slot set ups with Koford 450L magnets to become .550" and two Cahoza ULs with same magnets to become .535". Got through the two Pro Slots no problem. Then, on the first UL, the battery starts to run down. Now, this happens EVERY time I have motors to hone. If there are 2 motors, the battery dies in the middle of #2. If there are six, it dies during #5. Tonight it died during #3, so I didn't even let it completely die during hone #4....just put the battery in the recharger and wait until tomorrow night. Some things are very predictable. When I come home at night, I can always expect that when I open the door, right there at the bottom of the opening door with be the small beagle looking up. Every single time. Very predictable. Gotta go.

Jeff714
01-19-2011, 10:10 PM
Jeff, I just didn't have enough time to really assess Howard's troller, the FET. I got to SCR at 3:45 and Frank closed at 5:00. I did a number of 3.0 second laps with my Horky eurosport using the FET (that's a great lap time), but it felt very, very different from my Speedshop. I had a lot more trouble using it when I pulled out my F1 Eurosport. Tried the choke and it was so different, I couldn't figure it out in a short amount of time. Like with any new controller, you really have to commit to it, race it, practice with it, and basically MARRY IT! One thing I really like about the FET is the wide variance in sensitivity. The main problem I've had with the Speedshop is the huge missing gap in sensitivity settings when using the "hi-lo" switch....with the switch on and sensitivity pot all the way down, it's too sensitive. With the switch off and sensitivity pot all the way up, not sensitive enough...there's a gap. Maybe Howard can fix that problem. Anyway, I just need more time to assess it Jeff, but I'll keep ya posted.
" Slotcar Racer",
You are right on as usual man... At first the Fet did feel a bit different. That maybe because of the wire wound resister. As you and other racers have mentioned many times controllers are a very personal thing. When I got my Fet I was really hurting for a controller that had the feel I was looking for... It was really frustrating me! Mike Mazur and Roger were good enough to send me a conversion Mike had done and I really liked the feel and responsiveness. This particular one didn't have a choke setup but other than that it was a very good fit for me. I would recommend Mike's work any time to anyone! But that's a whole other thread... I know the Speed Shop controllers have been very good to you for many moons, results don't lie. But I'll bet you a whole dollar (maybe 2) That if you 'marry up" with the Fet for a few weeks, that demo just may not find it way back to Howard so quick. Oh and your wife may start to think Fet is a code name for the other woman like my wife does... :)

"Dub" Wade
01-19-2011, 10:40 PM
Hey George,
I know your a busy guy, but I enjoy asking tech questions and getting input from as many builders as I can.
I like building motors, and have tried so many different combinations of parts.
Right now I'm having the best luck with Red Fox cans, Proslot endbells and proslot copper hardware and Mura Red Dot magnets. Works great for box 12 motors .518 arms with .528 - .530 hole.
Scale motors .540 arms in .550 -.555 hole.
I built alot of Cahoza UL set ups with Koford, Mura and T5 mags and have had decent results on the flat track, but cant get a Box 12 motor to work. Over heats in less than 10 laps.
Ive gauss metered all mags and they Gauss considerably less in the UL can than Red Fox.
Example:
Mura Red Dots: 1050-1060 in RJR can, 930-950 in Red Fox/Koford UF and 800-825 in the Cahoza UL.
Kofords new Stronger Orientation designed for Wing Car or Drag use: RJR 980-990, Redfox 900-910, Cahoza UL 800-810

Im not an engineer or anything, but I have read alot and asked other builders questions maybe not as detailed as this, but got enough of a response to verify my theory.
Is it the can material that spreads the magnetic field out?

I have read the Slick 7 Magnet theory article and it talks about low magnetivity (dont think that is the correct word, but sounds good) creating heat. Is that why the Box 12 motors get hot?
I like building with the can, everything fits together well, runs super smooth.
I have 2nd guessed my building skills multiple times. I have built the UL can and aligned everything as perfect as I can, tried different air gaps .525,.528,.530,.532,.535,.538 with Mura, Koford and t5 mags. Koford 38- 42 and Proslot 38-42 arms. Tried Cahoza endbells $6 with gold hardware and heat sinks $16 retail. Tried my preference Proslot endbell and hardware kit $9 epoxied with koford endbell epoxy, S7 aluminum spring cups, champion lights, BFII, and TQ shunts. Nothing has worked.
Ive gotten a couple to survive a race and get real hot and slow down.
Am I doing something wrong? Or is it the can? If its the can, why are they so highly sought after?
I know I listed a ton of parts, but wanted to be thorough.
Also tried gearing from 8/39 to 9/39. Low downforce z28 to high downforce O/S Vette. X Hard big rim Kofords to Alpha Med Wonder on small. Too many combos to realistically list it all, but no luck.
Well, if i left something out, let me know if you dont mind.
Thank you sir
Respectfully,
Dub

KVAN
01-19-2011, 10:47 PM
Jeff don't be so persuasive.

A 3rd Eye Fettroller in the hands of Slotcar Racer, the rest of us will be racing for second. We will have absolutely no chance of beating him. More importantly remember.............................3rd Eye service, 2nd to none! Only 6 day turn around to Howard and back!

brassrodman
01-19-2011, 10:59 PM
Snore for the free plug!

GearBear
01-20-2011, 12:24 AM
Dustyn,

I'm sure George will have a better answer than I do. But I would suggest looking at the timing on the arms that were getting hot. I would bet that if you dropped down to a lower timed arm you won't see as much heat in the motor.

oldweirdherald
01-20-2011, 01:06 AM
Another suggestion or two... (just shots in the dark):

SPRING TENSION - Try going heavier AND lighter, and compare results (don't assume lighter=cooler!)

AIR GAP - again, try both more & less (don't assume more or less is better)

BTW - from the OWH slot car dictionary:

Spring Tension: When you can't get a date in March.

Air Gap: The space between a slot racer's ears.

Timing: Knowing when to let your wife to know you just bought a new controller...

:p

Slapshot
01-20-2011, 01:25 AM
Also got my new Valiko 25t25 arm with .250" stack length....it's gonna go into one of my bulked up Gulliver set ups after I bore it out to .490"....then it goes into my 32 Euro I ran at the Worlds. Might get that done in the next few daze, I mean days.

George:

Let me know how that turns out.

I've done alot of experimenting with narrowed cans and magnets and have encountered some variances pertaining to magnet thicknesses. We are talking reformed cans, or plus machined then honed to varing degrees.

I had a medium long discussion about the Gulliver awile back with Joel. One of the problems I encountered theres not enough "meat on the magnet" to turn over the arm with larger guage wire sufficiantly when you go larger than 470-480, and 490 is a bit bigger. I was about to try some early 90's arms that were in the 490 range to test this threroy but abandoned that during the Xmas season due to work.

The problem which occurs as the larger arm diamaters tend to not want to turn over, they act as a direct short or solenoid when less winds are incorperated. The coil over powers the magnet and hesitates turning. Horizontal brushes are an improvement on the issue but not a solver. Taller magnets and multi mags possibly will help. The same can happen if you go very small diamater, but can be overcome by using longer stack, with magnets or more windings on the arm.

You will probaly have better luck as I was using 24.5 and 24 winds and couple 19t 25.

Using the 25/25 490D 250 stack in a 504-506 hole may work fine but just wanted to give you a heads up as the magnet get thinner. Works fine especially if your can is a bit wider that most.

Raymond

ab slotsport
01-20-2011, 04:58 AM
Glad to see I am not the only one with fading batteries in my drill! I got over it by dumping the battery and hooking up my power supply direct to the battery terminals on the drill. Dial up the voltage and JOB DONE!

vbr

andy

ab slotsport
01-20-2011, 05:11 AM
I think the first question to ask with your dilema is are you cars reving out on the straight ? generally we tend to set up G12's here so they scream well before the breaking point on the straight. On scale tracks with G12 typical gear ratios with G12 motors are between 7/42 and 8/42. This is running Proslot and Koford G12 arms with 40 -42 degree timing, Proslot mega 3's or koford mags, light 5 coil camen springs, big foot or Golddust motor brushes and a 538 - 540 air gap. Armature balance is also critical and if bad will restrict high end revs. We have found that goldust brushes tend to give better brakes, but the dowside is they also seem to contaminate easier if oil gets on the com. In my experience, G12 love to rev and rev hard, this makes for a more "full on driving style" but it does seem to work.
Andy Brown-Searle
AB Slotsport

MantaRay
01-20-2011, 05:23 AM
SCRT.....What Koford Mags are you using?

ab slotsport
01-20-2011, 05:36 AM
Whatever turns up in the Koford box stock set-ups.

One interesting aspect on G12 came flitting through my in box this morning - As you guys probably know, in addition to the hawk 7, JK also has a "Hawk" motor, with removable endbell etc. This week it is announced that JK now have an all new endbell for this designed for full length motor brushes and "american coms" also a set of Neo replacement magnets. Hot on this announcment, Koford are making a G12 armature to fit this set-up. Sounds like an interesting combo - light, compact and quick - Now I just have to wait for the armatures to arrive and testing begining.

vbr

Andy
AB Slotsport

pilmat
01-20-2011, 05:57 AM
Whatever turns up in the Koford box stock set-ups.

One interesting aspect on G12 came flitting through my in box this morning - As you guys probably know, in addition to the hawk 7, JK also has a "Hawk" motor, with removable endbell etc. This week it is announced that JK now have an all new endbell for this designed for full length motor brushes and "american coms" also a set of Neo replacement magnets. Hot on this announcment, Koford are making a G12 armature to fit this set-up. Sounds like an interesting combo - light, compact and quick - Now I just have to wait for the armatures to arrive and testing begining.

vbr

Andy
AB Slotsport

What's the stock arm dia in the hawk? What do Koford have to do special to fit a X12 arm in there?

Found my own answer: http://www.koford.com/slot/pics.html

ab slotsport
01-20-2011, 07:31 AM
Hawk stack diameter is 0.513 and stack length is 0.395 but the actual armature length (front of com to back of rear spacer) is 0.905 so I guess shorter than a standard G12 which is think is 1.075

Slotcar Racer
01-20-2011, 01:35 PM
Just called Paul Pfeiffer to order some Cahoza carbon fibre rims. If these last a long time, the tolerance is down to .0027", so they are quite true. I ordered the .394" diameter and the .787" width. In the long run, I think these may be a good investment...they cost more, but more accurate. My experience with magnesium hubs lately has not been good. Only about half of what I get are reasonably true, and lately the set screw holes have been drilled too close to the edge of the hub so they strip out really easily. I'm hopeful these CZ hubs will work out better. I got em in 3/32" axle only. Unfortunately the 2mm hubs do not come in the .394" diameter, only in a larger .422" which I think is too big for cars running 44T 80 pitch spurs....I start at .650". Report to follow in a few weeks when I get my hands on these new rims.

Scale Series
01-20-2011, 01:56 PM
Russ:

What is thier weight and are they available in larger sizes?

oldweirdherald
01-20-2011, 02:13 PM
Slotcar Racer,

If you think the Carbon Fiber Rims are good, wait until you try them out with the latest, greatest, coolest combo yet...

Carbon Fiber Tires!!!

http://www.oldweirdherald.com/images/CarbonFiberTires.jpg

PK @ OWH :p

Mic Byrd
01-20-2011, 03:29 PM
Paul
They look like you can go off road with them also.

Big Mike1
01-20-2011, 03:31 PM
Paul
They look like you can go off road with them also.

Those things would work on a track i used to race at!!!!

GearBear
01-20-2011, 04:11 PM
Paul, you have way too much time on your hands!

BTW: Meagan is having her party at the track on Sunday. I'll try to get some photos for you.

Reaper802
01-20-2011, 04:20 PM
Just called Paul Pfeiffer to order some Cahoza carbon fibre rims. If these last a long time, the tolerance is down to .0027", so they are quite true. I ordered the .394" diameter and the .787" width. In the long run, I think these may be a good investment...they cost more, but more accurate. My experience with magnesium hubs lately has not been good. Only about half of what I get are reasonably true, and lately the set screw holes have been drilled too close to the edge of the hub so they strip out really easily. I'm hopeful these CZ hubs will work out better. I got em in 3/32" axle only. Unfortunately the 2mm hubs do not come in the .394" diameter, only in a larger .422" which I think is too big for cars running 44T 80 pitch spurs....I start at .650". Report to follow in a few weeks when I get my hands on these new rims.

Very interested in your results with these. The great thing about carbon fiber is that it's ether true or broken, nothing in between. Why are they only .787" in width? Shouldn't they be .800"?

oldweirdherald
01-20-2011, 05:08 PM
Very interested in your results with these.

Carbon Fiber Rim Straightening Tool:

But of course! a Carbon Fiber Wallet!

http://www.oldweirdherald.com/images/carbon_fiber_wallet.jpg



Why are they only .787" in width? Shouldn't they be .800"?

Perhaps the slightly narrower width is to allow you to insert a .013" Carbon Fiber Spacer on each side... I would guess... :p

You're right Gary... way too much time on my hands. I have no tools & no toys to build here!

Get that Carbon Fiber Body on Meagan's Carbon Fiber Womp for next week - I look forward to seeing pics of her racing party!

Hey Slotcar Racer - you've got some catching up to do! We've run away with your thread! :eek:

Berteinstein
01-20-2011, 06:57 PM
Just called Paul Pfeiffer to order some Cahoza carbon fibre rims. If these last a long time, the tolerance is down to .0027", so they are quite true. I ordered the .394" diameter and the .787" width. In the long run, I think these may be a good investment...they cost more, but more accurate. My experience with magnesium hubs lately has not been good.


The run-out on the carbon rims are better! The one draw back on the "carbon fibre rims" is that when the take an impact they tend to crack and break (usually the glue holds the broken piece until you go for the retread) Other than that they are great!

On a completely unrelated note: my carbon fibre wallet has lasted for the better part of 10yrs! (slightly frayed on the edges though- leather trim failure)

Jerry123
01-20-2011, 07:22 PM
I ordered the .394" diameter and the .787" width.

Any advantage to the narrower rim? I just assumed the narrower rim would be a disadvantage, but that's what I get when I think and not test. I believe the Speedshop rims are right around .810 wide so were are talking about a pretty big difference of .023.

Slotcar Racer
01-20-2011, 08:42 PM
Hey George,
I know your a busy guy, but I enjoy asking tech questions and getting input from as many builders as I can.
I like building motors........
Well, if i left something out, let me know if you dont mind.
Thank you sir
Respectfully,
Dub

Dustyn, let me send you a PM, you have a lot of q's here.

Slotcar Racer

Slotcar Racer
01-20-2011, 08:45 PM
Jeff don't be so persuasive.

A 3rd Eye Fettroller in the hands of Slotcar Racer, the rest of us will be racing for second. We will have absolutely no chance of beating him. More importantly remember.............................3rd Eye service, 2nd to none! Only 6 day turn around to Howard and back!

Yeah Kevin, Jeff was very persuasive. I need to give Howard a call and let him know I haven't eloped with his loaner controller. Actually, I think I will need to get back up to Frank's this Saturday and put in more time. I want to see if Howard can fill the "sensitivity gap" on my Speedshops too. I know he did a great job of working on a CZ controller, an older one, that Hermanator now loves. I saw the Hermanator last Sunday, we had some fun with F1s on the Testarossa. Anyway, if Howard can't figure out the Speedshop sensitivity gap, then next stop is Mazur.

Slotcar Racer
01-20-2011, 08:52 PM
George:

Let me know how that turns out.


[COLOR=purple]Using the 25/25 490D 250 stack in a 504-506 hole may work fine but just wanted to give you a heads up as the magnet get thinner. Works fine especially if your can is a bit wider that most.

Raymond

Raymond, as always you are absolutely correct. I actually abandoned the idea of using a Gulliver for this new Valiko arm I got. The reason being, the comm spacing is not right. The Gullivers are designed pretty much the same as the Speedshop small block, for the standard "PK length" armatures...which the Valiko .290 stackers fall into the same category. In fact, Lee orders his .250 stack arms from Valiko with comm spacing for the small block set up. The 250 stack 25t25 I just received has shorter comm spacing, so today I packed it up and shipped it to Joel and ordered a new quad set up for it. It'll be regular width so as not to diminish the magnet mass as you astutely notated. The Gullivers being only about .600" wide o.d. really do need the smaller diameter arms to maintain enough mag mass. Lately we've found the .470" diameter is optimal. I have a Gullie six mag with a Valiko 23/25 turned down to .470 that turns sub 3s on the Testarossa.

Slotcar Racer
01-20-2011, 08:56 PM
Russ:

What is thier weight and are they available in larger sizes?

Not sure about weight, and they are available in different sizes. Go to cahoza.cz and check out the wheel area of the website.

GearBear
01-20-2011, 08:58 PM
You know George, my main Speedshop doesn't have the Hi/Lo switch for sensitivity and I've run everything from TJet's to Euros with it and never once needed it. On my backups, both of them have them and I don't really like the feel of either one. I wish they were all like my main one.

Unfortunately, I fried the new transistors on my main controller so I have to replace them before the next race. I also need to call Jim about my Difalco as I think I have it figured out for slower cars, but can't seem to get it dialed in for the faster classes yet.

Slotcar Racer
01-20-2011, 09:06 PM
Any advantage to the narrower rim? I just assumed the narrower rim would be a disadvantage, but that's what I get when I think and not test. I believe the Speedshop rims are right around .810 wide so were are talking about a pretty big difference of .023.

Jerry, you bring up a good point, and the narrower width kind of made me wonder a little. Honestly I don't know why Cahoza is making these narrower than the legal width for ISRA International and most other racing rules. I'm afraid I might be largely swayed by, "If Horky can win with it, maybe I can do a little better with them too". But seriously, I think you can allow the tires to be .810" wide on one of these rims and the overhang will not be objectionable. We actually did this with narrow rims back in the mid 90s, often the rim were not a full .812" or whatever the hell the maximum is. Sorry Paul, I said hell. Bad word. Also some have brought up the disadvantage of the rims breaking instead of bending as magnesium does. So why did I order some Cahoza hubs? Slotcar Racer tests, tests, and tests. I haven't tried them, so it's time to give them a go. Also, I have always used the Speedshop rims fabricated by Sonic. I don't want to knock the product, but easily half of what I get is visibly out of true. I mean, they wobble. These all go to the practice pile, and they work fine for practice. I have a whole pile of Speedshop/Sonic rims that "look" true....I even touch them up on the Unimat. I do not have a run out gauge to test them, but I'll bet the ones that "look true" would show a lot more wobble than the .0027" tolerance the carbon fibers purportedly have. Eurosport rear axle calculated at up to 15,000 rpm, so balance and trueness I would think would make that extra difference. Onward with the quest for more speed.

Jeff714
01-20-2011, 10:16 PM
Jeff don't be so persuasive.

A 3rd Eye Fettroller in the hands of Slotcar Racer, the rest of us will be racing for second. We will have absolutely no chance of beating him. More importantly remember.............................3rd Eye service, 2nd to none! Only 6 day turn around to Howard and back!

Kevin,

Slotcar Race is infamous not invincible! :)

Slotcar Racer
01-21-2011, 09:14 AM
Kevin,

Slotcar Race(r) is infamous not invincible! :)

You got it right Jeff!

Slotcar Racer
01-21-2011, 09:16 AM
slotcar racer,

if you think the carbon fiber rims are good, wait until you try them out with the latest, greatest, coolest combo yet...

Carbon fiber tires!!!


pk @ owh :p

more glue!!!

Slotcar Racer
01-21-2011, 09:37 AM
Hey George,

Hi there DustynI know your a busy guy, but I enjoy asking tech questions and getting input from as many builders as I can.

How did you know we've been busy this week? Man, it has been a madhouse at work. I finally got a chance to sit down this morning and actually get in touch with my friends!

I like building motors, and have tried so many different combinations of parts.

I think if you stay with this last statement, you are in better shape than most people. I can sort of see what you wrote below already, and that is all a subset of "I like building motors".

Right now I'm having the best luck with Red Fox cans, Proslot endbells and proslot copper hardware

I really like the Red Fox three hole can and the P/S endbell is the best bargain in slotcar racing. Sometimes I use the four hole, but only if I need a really powerful almost violent motor, the can has a lot of gauss even though I don't own a gauss meter.....
and Mura Red Dot magnets. Works great for box 12 motors .518 arms with .528 - .530 hole.

Dustyn, when I was a track owner 1995-2000, I always kept a 12" pegboard hook full of Muras....when I got down to four pairs, it was time to reorder because by the time the Eagle order arrived, those four pairs could be sold already. They have always been a great magnet

Scale motors .540 arms in .550 -.555 hole.

Yep, that's the way to do it, I agree. Unfortunately, our local NORCAL series does not allow big arms for some reason....not a good reason

I built alot of Cahoza UL set ups with Koford, Mura and T5 mags and have had decent results on the flat track, but cant get a Box 12 motor to work. Over heats in less than 10 laps.

OK, so you have used the Cahoza stuff on your flat track, but you're getting overheating with air cars. Unfortunately, that is not my area of expertise, but if the Cahoza motors are working OK on the flat track, then just use them there, don't bother using them for the air cars.

Ive gauss metered all mags and they Gauss considerably less in the UL can than Red Fox.
Example:
Mura Red Dots: 1050-1060 in RJR can, 930-950 in Red Fox/Koford UF and 800-825 in the Cahoza UL.
Kofords new Stronger Orientation designed for Wing Car or Drag use: RJR 980-990, Redfox 900-910, Cahoza UL 800-810

I'm not much of a believer in using meters and trying to measure stuff. I am more like your original statement "I like to build motors" so I build and build and build and test, test, test. If it doesn't work, I put that in my notebook and try not to do it again. Do you see a correlation between the higher gauss readings and performance with your Box 12 cars? If so, just stay with what works best.

Im not an engineer or anything, but I have read alot and asked other builders questions maybe not as detailed as this, but got enough of a response to verify my theory.
Is it the can material that spreads the magnetic field out?

Here again I am not a theoretician, I rely on empirical evidence. If a parts combination works CONSISTENTLY, I race it and I keep building it.

I have read the Slick 7 Magnet theory article and it talks about low magnetivity (dont think that is the correct word, but sounds good) creating heat. Is that why the Box 12 motors get hot?

I do know that if the magnets are weak, you will get heat, then the heat makes the magnets weaker and you get a vicious cycle leading to a blow up. I knew this going back to my motor building days in the mid 60s when I rewound everything.

I like building with the can, everything fits together well, runs super smooth.

You are probably referring to the Cahoza stuff....yes, it all fits together so well it almost takes the fun out of motor building!!!!!

I have 2nd guessed my building skills multiple times. I have built the UL can and aligned everything as perfect as I can, tried different air gaps .525,.528,.530,.532,.535,.538 with Mura, Koford and t5 mags. Koford 38- 42 and Proslot 38-42 arms. Tried Cahoza endbells $6 with gold hardware and heat sinks $16 retail. Tried my preference Proslot endbell and hardware kit $9 epoxied with koford endbell epoxy, S7 aluminum spring cups, champion lights, BFII, and TQ shunts. Nothing has worked.

Easy answer: stop wasting your time with the Cahoza UL can for Box Cars.

Ive gotten a couple to survive a race and get real hot and slow down.

Easy answer: stop wasting your time with the Cahoza UL can for Box Car

Am I doing something wrong?

Yes, you are doing something wrong, you are doing the same thing over and over again expecting a different result. I believe it was Freud who referred to that as the definition of insanity.

Or is it the can? If its the can, why are they so highly sought after?

I think scale racers use the Cahoza stuff. Do you know any air cars guys using it?


I know I listed a ton of parts, but wanted to be thorough.

Yes you were thorough. I hope my answer is not too simple for you!!!!

Also tried gearing from 8/39 to 9/39. Low downforce z28 to high downforce O/S Vette. X Hard big rim Kofords to Alpha Med Wonder on small. Too many combos to realistically list it all, but no luck.
Well, if i left something out, let me know if you dont mind.

It seems to me you have tested everything that does NOT work, so it is time to take notes on those combinations and do not try them any more. It is time to put your time and testing into the motor combinations that you find work best. If a motor is heating up too much and you can narrow your results down to motor components and/or gearing, then you know you are going down a dead end street, time to turn around and go back to Main Street.

Thank you sir
Respectfully,
Dub

Dustyn "Dub" Wade

KVAN
01-21-2011, 10:00 AM
Hey Jeff, don't be fooled, Slotcar Racer is dishing up a little humble pie today. I've been the recipient of this in the past right before he has administered a most thorough butt whooping. Notice who is holding the fishing pole on the cover of OWH shortly after doing the same at last years Nats @ Chicks. :):):)

Slotcar Racer, do you know if those were Cahoza hubs Regor had at the Masters last year? They were very very nice, but mucho $$$$. I believe Brian Meharry used them in his B Production win. I have rerubbered them a couple times and they have held up very nicely, a good purchase.

Slotcar Racer
01-23-2011, 09:17 AM
Slotcar Racer has been busy the past few days prepping for a test session at Slot Car Raceway, Rohnert Park, Calif. site of the 2006 & 2008 USRA Scale Nats. Test session was yesterday and had mostly to do with more time on the FET troller. Howard drove over to the shop with Tanner the Slot Dog and readjusted the trigger as the wiper was missing the middle of the windings. Once that was accomplished, it was a lot of fast laps with my Horky 24 Euro.

Howard is such a cool guy, he also fixed my Speedshop troller which had a resistor disconnected from one of the feel-good switches....oh yeah, those are the "hi-lo" switches Alex puts on his redesigned Ruddock. All of a sudden, the sensitivity actually works on it now! I think I'm going to end up purchasing a FET at some point in the future, it has spectacular brakes and all the sensitivity control you'd ever want.

I'm not sure yet about the voltage choke, although I did run my 1/32 F1 Eurosport so many laps I blew the tires off it...must have been a few hundred or so.

Back to the 24 Euro, I started with a new 455T X 300L single mag Camen set up and a PK 19t25 arm. It was quite fast and driveable with some choke. Straight up it was a bit unwieldy and lap times not as good. The track was not at it's best as there was a birthday party beforehand, and that lays down a nasty layer of Parma rental car tire.....not a good mix with european fish rubber. It takes some time to bring the track in, but it never really got as fast as it has been on other days. Anyway, I switched out motors to a Gulliver 6 mag with a Valiko 23t25 ground down to .470" and it smoked the previous motor!! I don't know why it is, but I have been down this road too many times. Try big wire armatures in big stinky set ups and it is no better than the lowly 23t25 armature. I just don't get it. Some things are not meant to be understood by mere mortals. Better go, gotta get started on some new UL set ups....

Slotcar Racer
01-24-2011, 02:10 PM
In our last episode, CRASH CODGER was seen driving home with wife Shorty from the Elephant Bar. Shorty wanted CRASH to try the ribs, but did not say anything and was therefore disappointed about the whole meal. CRASH CODGER got the shrimp with Japanese noodles instead. The visit to The Bar included CRASH CODGER’s Mom and Dad…you can only imagine how old they are considering how old the CODGER himself is. The Elephant Bar was too loud and CODGER’S Dad couldn't tell if the waitress was talking to him or to somebody else, but he wish she was talking to him cuz she was easy on the eyes. Pass the salsa. Uncle CRASH with his Japanese noodles and shrimp was having a miserable time forcing down what was supposed to look something like the appetizing full color photo on the menu.

Meanwhile, further north and west in the State of California, Evil (Slotcar Racer) was thrashing as usual in his workshop hard at work ruining a new armature. Today there is a Unimat lathe sitting in a closet being punished for its indiscretions. We’ll go no further with details.

As Sunday continued, CRASH CODGER pulls into Casa Hood and proceeds immediately to the slot room where he finds the two PS 16D motors instead of the one 16D and one S16D thanks to the dummies who sent them. The bathroom had some FAST ORANGE cleaner which CRASH CODGER thought he'd try cleaning some of the dreaded rusty chassis. Not knowing how long it takes Evil to clean a chassis, CRASH CODGER is wondering what to do not realizing it depends on how bad the rust is. Little did he know that Evil uses the pumice cleaner mostly to clean up minor rust spots on bare steel chassis after races.

While all this is going on, illegitimate son Herman is even further north in the City of Fairfield running his children around the neighborhoods at speeds approaching 100mph thinking that he is back in the days when he was a real race car driver (haaaa haaaaaa haaaaaa….wwwweeeeeeeeee) or even drag racing on San Pablo Dam Road. The children are huddled in the back seat trying not to scream for fear it will break the insane trance their father is currently in and he might actually drive into a tree. They just want the ride to be over and for their illegitimate Grandfather (CRASH CODGER) to visit them.

The day continues as our view shifts 750 miles further north to the great land of Seattle where Mikeeee is putting a Spatula Eurosport on Old Weird Herald to sell. As he types, tears are streaming down his face in his own self pity over the terrible Seattle weather. "AAwwww, pooooorrr Mikkeeeeee" he is thinking as he types in the description for the spatula slot car.

Then, later that day our attention shifts some 3,000 miles east to Appomattox, Virginia where an ancient mad scientist is working late into the night running machines and repeating to himself the incantation:

TEAM CAMEN LOGIC
TEAM CAMEN LOGIC
TEAM CAMEN LOGIC
TEAM CAMEN LOGIC
TEAM CAMEN LOGIC
TEAM CAMEN LOGIC
TEAM CAMEN LOGIC
TEAM CAMEN LOGIC....

So Sunday merged into Monday and CRASH CODGER woke up early in the morning with barely any sunshine as he opens his bedroom window. He looks outside, stretches and thinks to himself, "THE USUAL". Another days begins in the lives of CRASH and Evil.

KVAN
01-24-2011, 02:59 PM
What no pictures?

Slotcar Racer
01-25-2011, 09:17 AM
Last night Slotcar Racer did some work leftover from the ISRA World Championship held in October at Mid America Raceway, Downers Grove, Illinois. This was the much needed learning to adjust the pan height of the new Horky 24 Eurosport chassis. I finally acquired the tools needed to make good pan adjustments, then just put in the time last night to figure out a way to do it. Last week I got a new flat aluminum block, something I've needed to really check the set up of chassis. I've had an allie block for years, but it is kind of messed up. Also picked up a new Corian block at TNT Raceway in Modesto.

PG (Paul Gawronski) received a lesson from Vladimir at the Worlds on how to make the adjustment, and PG passed that on to me one evening. I finally figured out that it really takes a strip of .010" bullet proofing under each pan to get the pans to be level with the bottom of the center section. I had tried the .005" bullet proofing before, but the pans still hang too low. The other trick is to stick a 2" long piece of stainless pin tubing on the end of the pin on the chassis....this is the pin you have to unsolder to adjust the height. Adding the pin tube gave me something to hold on to and to keep the whole thing parallel to the board.

OK, did this adjustment last night and then turned down a pair of used euro tires all the way down to .595" and put them on the car. Hurray, under the axle uprights I have .007" clearance, and both pans just click on the block when I push them down, so they have sufficient clearance to allow the car to run the tires down to zero.

By the end of the week, I should have my new tall block from Joel, that's a SINGLE MAG .480"T X .300"L set up....those are tall and narrow singles folks. I'm planning to put a Valiko 22t24.5 in it, then it goes into the Horky and we'll test both the motor, and run the tires down to nothing. Report to follow. Gotta go...

KVAN
01-26-2011, 08:05 AM
Slotcar Racer, thanks for passing along the Horky chassis tip, if you see Paul G. tell him thank you as well! As detail oriented as Mr. Horky is, and as expensive as his chassis are, I find it troubling that he lets the chassis out the door without this being adjusted correctly.

Slotcar Racer
01-26-2011, 10:12 AM
Kevin Van Pelt, midwest slotcar racer, you are welcome. Now a few more of us are "in the know" about how Vladimir does things. Supposed they come adjusted for the 3 minute heat (except when there is .015" of rubber on the track) race and you raise the pans as you move up and the heats get longer. I think with practice, one can get good at making this adjustment, and the pin tube idea works well. PG even said you might run the pans ABOVE the center section for 5 minute heats. After I test this weekend, I may even try that setting and see how it works.

Zippity
01-26-2011, 01:17 PM
Slotcar Racer,

Any chance of a photograph or two to better expalin what you are saying in post #103?

I too have a Horky 24 Eurosport chassis which I would love to be able to tweak :) :) :)

Thanks in advance.

Slotcar Racer
01-26-2011, 05:52 PM
I'll get right on it Zippity. Got a fresh battery in the Nikon Coolpix 8800 last night ready to take more slotcar racer photos. I'll set up some photos of the adjustment process.

Slapshot
01-26-2011, 08:21 PM
By the end of the week, I should have my new tall block from Joel, that's a SINGLE MAG .480"T X .300"L set up....those are tall and narrow singles folks. I'm planning to put a Valiko 22t24.5 in it, then it goes into the Horky and we'll test both the motor, and run the tires down to nothing. Report to follow. Gotta go...

Ahhhhh that will be end of next following week he has a couple other items of another Camenskateer in the "Camen Logic" oven.

While you waiting for your .480 tall ask Joel to stick 18 mags in there, the two I got are sweet horsepower and love the 19 to 17/24 just fine......

Raymond

Berteinstein
01-26-2011, 09:36 PM
Slotcar Racer-
Any tips for testing cars without a track? You are making me jealous- Do you offer some sort of mail the car to you, tell me what you think, mail the car back to me... kinda program?

PS- Remember to charge the camera batteries as I am trying to picture what you are talking about adjustment wise on the Horky and it is making my head hurt-

Slotcar Racer
01-27-2011, 10:59 AM
Due to a number of requests, here is a set of photos on Flickr with my Horky adjustment steps:

http://www.flickr.com/photos/56038309@N08/

Slotcar Racer

Slotcar Racer
01-27-2011, 11:04 AM
Slotcar Racer-
Any tips for testing cars without a track? You are making me jealous- Do you offer some sort of mail the car to you, tell me what you think, mail the car back to me... kinda program?

PS- Remember to charge the camera batteries as I am trying to picture what you are talking about adjustment wise on the Horky and it is making my head hurt-

Jason, you can leave Reno at 9:00am on Saturdays and be at Frank's by Noon to test, right? Isn't it about 3 hours Reno to Rohnert Park? How about testing at Rocklin when Dwight gets the flat track up and running? That should be a good test track. As far as the Horky adjustments go, take three aspirin and look at the Flickr photos I just posted.

Slotcar Racer
01-27-2011, 11:05 AM
Hi Ray, got the tall block yesterday, loaded a Valiko 22t24.5 in it last night and now that I've taken photos of my Horky for Flickr, I am going to load that lump into the Horky. I think Saturday will be a good day to go to Frank's.

GearBear
01-27-2011, 02:01 PM
George,

Thanks for the pics! Now I understand what you are talking about. Just an observation, it might be easier to go to your local auto part store and buy a set of feeler gauges. Take the 15 thou and put it under the pan before moving your pin. ;)

patraceruk
01-28-2011, 04:14 AM
George
Great step by step instructions.
Rumour has it that the great Recek himself is coming to our 24 Nats in August. I'll take questions for him if you like.
Pat (look out for next issue of SCRN with exclusive Horky interview within.)

Slotcar Racer
01-28-2011, 09:24 AM
Pat, with Recek coming to your Nats, he's another Czech to add to that race. I know you had more last summer including Tony Jr. Looking forward to reading the Horky interview. I've always wondered if Vladimir speaks much English....or did you employ the services of a translator? I was completely impressed by Mr. Horky and the entire Czech crew at The Worlds last October, what an operation.

Slotcar Racer
01-28-2011, 09:29 AM
George,

Thanks for the pics! Now I understand what you are talking about. Just an observation, it might be easier to go to your local auto part store and buy a set of feeler gauges. Take the 15 thou and put it under the pan before moving your pin. ;)

Hi Gary, why don't you try it out? However, one thing to keep in mind, the goal of the pan height adjustment is to be able to do it between races quickly. This is a fast and dirty chassis adjustment....think crank going in rear window and two turns....It's really easy to have a couple of pieces of bulletproofing ready to stick on the pan, then hit the pins, especially when the adreneline is still pumping through your system. I think you'd find steel feeler gauges would be too long and move around all over the place unless you made some kind of permanent changing block. Yeah, I have feeler gauges already, if you'll remember this Saturday when I go for the test session, my Horky is at .007" clearance right now (checking with a feeler gauge) and the tires are at .595"....I want to see IF it handles...HOW it handles...and HOW LONG it will handle...if I get 30 laps, that will be very good.

Mic Byrd
01-28-2011, 09:40 AM
Slotcar Racer
Don't own a horky but great info non the less .could be way horky ran so well in the worlds seem he had just enough tire left there at the end.

GearBear
01-28-2011, 10:10 AM
George,

I haven't picked up a Horky... Yet... Still on the fence about spending $275 for just a chassis.

oldweirdherald
01-28-2011, 10:19 AM
George,

I haven't picked up a Horky... Yet... Still on the fence about spending $275 for just a chassis.

That's a pretty tall fence!

Slotcar Racer
01-29-2011, 11:48 AM
OK, shifting away from Eurosport since last night.....the Horky is in my box waiting for Sunday testing.....Skinnered in three pairs of T5s last night: two UL set ups ($$$$$) and one Kelly four hole can with PS endbell (<$$$) This will be about experimenting with some different ideas, not just more of the same. Let's just say I am only working with maximum diameter .518" arms right now. Next big race is NORCAL first Saturday in March at TNT Raceway in Modesto, CA. NORCAL does not allow arms larger than .518"....in fact, one of the tech directors has this funky little gadget that lights up or does something....they are doing their due diligence in preventing the uncontrolled spread of big diameter C Can arms. The strangest part about this set of rules is they allow 16D arms up to .560". Don't even wonder why. Anyway, I got the Kelly set up loaded up this morning with a Koford Competitor arm 40* .518"D, put a 7T pinion on it for starters (the Corkscrew is at most 90' long, probably less). Then, it took a really long time to straighten out my Nats winning Cheetah 11 from the last race at Modesto which was a crash fest. This time I'm going to use the 16* angled spur for more gear contact. Got a new JK Products BMW mounted and will test tomorrow along with the Horky. Gotta go.

MantaRay
01-29-2011, 11:52 AM
SR...........do you know the part number of the JK BMW?

Mic Byrd
01-29-2011, 12:25 PM
Slotcar Racer
Got to try an x-25 specially for those tough races . takes a licking and keeps on ticking . 047 bite bar and a body with a little less down force and your rocking.

Slotcar Racer
01-29-2011, 04:19 PM
Slotcar Racer
Got to try an x-25 specially for those tough races . takes a licking and keeps on ticking . 047 bite bar and a body with a little less down force and your rocking.

Mic, I'd love to use my X25 for NORCAL....but like large diameter C Can arms, it is not legal. Tempting to use the Champion chassis I used for ISRA Production at the Worlds, it's actually a really good one, and we know the Champion can take a lot....Right now starting to build a Tazer for Hermanator....have the parts cut off and just soldered in the pillow blocks....now on to the guide tongue....

Slotcar Racer
01-29-2011, 04:20 PM
SR...........do you know the part number of the JK BMW?

Ray I didn't save the header card...threw it in recycling then squirted the body. It's the open cockpit one, I'm pretty sure it's JK 7184A. Really good body, Lee Gilbert recommended it to me. I tried it against the other usual bodies and it's a winner for me.

Slotcar Racer
01-30-2011, 12:50 PM
Got a lot done this morning. Rebuilt my 32 Euro motor I ran at The Worlds. Same motor that won the USRA Nats both 32 AND 24 Euro, one of those good ones. It's just a plain old Speedshop small block, a little shorter mags than usual, .390"T X .330"L and a Valiko 23t25. Simple stuff. Did a big clean up on Horky 32 Euro chassis #1, then installed the motor, new tires, good body. Will run some laps with the FET controller with this car this afternoon. Better pack up my stuff and load the car. Gotta go.

KVAN
01-30-2011, 08:48 PM
Slotcar Racer, when is Mom going to give you your own thread in the "Tech Tips Q & A" section?

You are the only expert I see giving any useful tips on a regular basis. I find, and I'm sure others do as well, your daily blog of racing experiences very helpful and enlightening compared to all of the other drama seen on here regularly!

Mom, are you watching? 124 replies and 4700 views in less than a month, with all very respectful posts and questions.

Berteinstein
01-30-2011, 11:49 PM
SR-
Have you noticed that when mounting bodies on the Horky Chassis that the body wants to pull the pans up in the air? I am not sure that this is the ideal position for the pans- I have tried a couple of different bodies and have even tried increasing the crease on the edges of the bodies and decreasing the crease on the edges- but nothing seems to help- any thoughts? Also thank you for the pictures on the pan ride height adjustment, my head can now return to the standard dull painlessness it usually feels-
Jason

Slotcar Racer
01-31-2011, 05:53 PM
Slotcar Racer, when is Mom going to give you your own thread in the "Tech Tips Q & A" section?

You are the only expert I see giving any useful tips on a regular basis. I find, and I'm sure others do as well, your daily blog of racing experiences very helpful and enlightening compared to all of the other drama seen on here regularly!

Mom, are you watching? 124 replies and 4700 views in less than a month, with all very respectful posts and questions.

Kevin, as always very kind words, thank you. Paul and I discussed this a month ago. My thought was to keep it on Slotcar Talk in order to keep us talking about slotcars. I'll PM Paul and see what his thoughts are. I'm open to anything as long as it keeps us on the subject of how we work on our slotcars.

Slotcar Racer
01-31-2011, 05:58 PM
SR-
Have you noticed that when mounting bodies on the Horky Chassis that the body wants to pull the pans up in the air? I am not sure that this is the ideal position for the pans- I have tried a couple of different bodies and have even tried increasing the crease on the edges of the bodies and decreasing the crease on the edges- but nothing seems to help- any thoughts? Also thank you for the pictures on the pan ride height adjustment, my head can now return to the standard dull painlessness it usually feels-
Jason

Jason, I have not noticed that. Herman and I spent about 3 hours straight yesterday with my Horky. We were testing different trollers....we went through three sets of tires!!!! The track had a lot of rubber on it and was just eating up tire mileage. I will go home and check my car, but that is the sort of thing I watch out for. If it is goofing around with the pans, we'll need to find a way out of that problem. Lemme check it out.

We tested my new Camen single mag set up, it's a .480T X .300L magnets, sort of same dimensions as the Valiko radials, but these are singles. It is really sweet. Herman got a number of 3.0s, and the track was really in need of cleaning. Not only a lot of rubber, but dried up too. The car unloaded a number of times it was so tight. But we ran a Valiko 22t24.5 arm in this set up. I loaded up the Gulliver six mag with the Valiko 23t25 after a few hours of testing and it was very quick, but lap times not as fast.

With the controllers, I better think about what I want to say about that a little more before I post something. I want to be precise about my feedback.

Slotcar Racer
02-01-2011, 09:51 AM
I’ve had to think a couple of days about controllers before saying anything. In our testing on Sunday, Herman and I ran one car, my Horky eurosport, and tested two Speedshops (my Dr. Verdo and the latest design by Alex), Ryan’s Carsteen, Howard’s FET demo controller, and Herman’s Czech controller modified by Howard. Both the FET and the Carsteen are really quite different from the Speedshops. Both Herman and I had to make major “driver modifications” to get the same result for the car. Using “Speedshop Driver Input” with the FET resulted in the car going all crazy, especially in the esses on the Testarossa. However, like I said, that craziness could be modified by changing how we drove. I can’t say if in the long run that would be more work, but it certainly left us thinking that if the Speedshop works OK with a eurosport, no need to change to something else and on top of it change driving style. Interestingly, the modified Czech controller felt very similar to the Speedshop and we got the fastest lap times with it. The only conclusion I can come to is this: you just have to pick a controller and master your driving. I drove a Carsteen exclusively for well over a year and had a lot of success with it. However, once I bought the Dr. Verdo Speedshop, I used it exclusively for Eurosport. Herman and I both agree that the Speedshop is very driveable for eurosport….it delivers an almost brain-dead kind of driveability. You can go on auto pilot, let the car float around the track and watch for wrecks more easily. Now, that isn’t to say you could learn the same thing with another controller….it’s just that for me right now I own two Speedshops, so it doesn’t make much sense at this moment to add another controller to my inventory that is so different in feel.

Mike K
02-01-2011, 12:18 PM
Mr SR Sir-
What difference, if any, does the Dr. V SS controller have over others?

Thanks in advance!

Slotcar Racer
02-01-2011, 01:10 PM
Mr SR Sir-
What difference, if any, does the Dr. V SS controller have over others?

Thanks in advance!

Mike Kravitz, bet you aren't flying into Midway today! The Speedshop controllers, as you know, are redesigned Ruddock DR40s. I think Dr. Verdo may have worked with Alex on the sensitivity resistors on his troller because it has higher sensitivity than my original orange handled one. Lee Gilbert has had several of these controllers over the years and says they are all a little bit different from eachother. Dunno why, maybe because it is kind of a handbuilt conversion? I know Lee has always liked Alicia's controller, that's been a good one. Greg Gilbert has had a number of Alex conversions over the years and has done pretty well (!) with them. My orange handle Speedshop has a switch that Alex added recently which turns off the power relay, great for F1 Eurosport. That reminds me of one thing Howard pointed out about the FET, you do not have a jump as you do on a troller with a power relay. The control is even from the braking position to the full position because of no full power relay.

mazur50
02-01-2011, 01:37 PM
The transistor is the cause for the difference from full power with the relay and with out. There is a .7 volt difference.

When you turn the relay off you are apply a voltage choke to the controler just like you get when turning the relay off on the pro3.

You don't have the voltage drop when using a MOSFET. Hence you don't need the relay. But as the heat is increase in the MOSFET the resistance will increase. I my self would still like a relay on a MOSFET controller for tracks like a king. But turn it off on a flat track or gutters on a king. George let me know if you want to make your controller more sensitive.

Mike

I typed this on my phone so I will correct errors when I get home

mazur50
02-01-2011, 01:37 PM
The transistor is the cause for the difference from full power with the relay and with out. There is a .7 volt difference.

When you turn the relay off you are apply a voltage choke to the controler just like you get when turning the relay off on the pro3.

You don't have the voltage drop when using a MOSFET. Hence you don't need the relay. But as the heat is increase in the MOSFET the resistance will increase. I my self would still like a relay on a MOSFET controller for tracks like a king. But turn it off on a flat track or gutters on a king. George let me know if you want to make your controller more sensitive.

Mike

I typed this on my phone so I will correct errors when I get home

topkat
02-01-2011, 02:08 PM
SR-
Have you noticed that when mounting bodies on the Horky Chassis that the body wants to pull the pans up in the air? I am not sure that this is the ideal position for the pans- I have tried a couple of different bodies and have even tried increasing the crease on the edges of the bodies and decreasing the crease on the edges- but nothing seems to help- any thoughts? Also thank you for the pictures on the pan ride height adjustment, my head can now return to the standard dull painlessness it usually feels-
Jason

Hey Jason, i had an issue very close to yours, and what i found was that i had the body mounts on the chassis to far out and too much reinforcement on the body ( adhesive + ninja star + .010 bullet proofing and celo tape) on both sides . Hope that helps......... see you in a couple weeks?

Mike K
02-01-2011, 04:13 PM
Mike Kravitz, bet you aren't flying into Midway today! .

You are CORRECT! But I did leave O'Hare on Sunday!

I had two Speedshop DR40s in an earlier life (before my interest in flat track racing....). Just wondering if there was a different set up. Still want to see what Mr. Mazur is doing with controllers. Hopefully will see his efforts in February at the Masters.

Berteinstein
02-01-2011, 10:28 PM
Thank you Hermshow- I will try to adjust the pin tube and see what that gets me- I do not run a TON of body reinforcement, usually a piece of the bulletproofing and the koford strapping tape on a 45 degree angle so that the lines form perpendicular angles to each other inside vs. outside.
I will be there for sure- I might see if I can get "permission" for a Friday test session- FINGERS CROSSED!!!!
Jason

Slotcar Racer
02-02-2011, 01:03 PM
Last night I started to build the new motors with recently acquired ($$$) parts (Cahoza$$$). Of course, the Cahoza parts practically fall together with no work at all...maybe the most work is scoring the inside of the can for the Skinner glue! So far I've loaded up one Koford G12 arm 42* into one of the Cahozas, still need to put a new BOW G12 arm in the other. Got the BOW Contender rebalanced after putting a race on it, that will go into the Kelly four hole with the T5 magnets, the Brute Set Up. Hopefully get that all done tonight. Fred and I are planning a chassis and motor building workshop out at TNT Raceway in Modesto. Our first workshop Fred built a Champion Turboflex and I rebuilt a bag motor. This time, Fred is doing a Cheetah 11 (a lot more work!) and I'm building a motor from parts. We're looking at Feb 12 or 19. Uh oh, gotta go...

patraceruk
02-03-2011, 08:47 AM
At the club last night and did some testing for Area Nationals qualification round next week. I ran a replica of your 32 esport. Old Horky chassis with Camen speedshop single mag set up with Valiko 23/25. Car was very smooth and easy to drive. Thanks to you may have finally found a stand by car to my new Horky with horky 12 mag motor.

all your talk of controllers ahas spurred me on to get used to my new defalco. I've hooked it up to a Koford choke and got some new chips made by Mike read here in the UK. It came with a 180 chip (not much use) and a 148 chip (falcon cars) main purpose of the test was to find a controler to tame my new Horky f1 motor 36/27. I used a new 52 chip with full choke and bingo I can now drive the car. It felt awesome. I ran a new 29 chip for the 32 Es and it felt great. Then moved onto our gp 12 32 saloon class using the 52 chip. it felt great as well. The relay and brake circuit is a real step up from the Kapriwa so I guess I'll be using the defalco from now on. Brai Saunders has been on at me for 6 months to do this. Should have listened earlier but it did require a choke which I have only recently acquired.

Slotcar Racer
02-03-2011, 10:46 AM
At the club last night and did some testing for Area Nationals qualification round next week. I ran a replica of your 32 esport. Old Horky chassis with Camen speedshop single mag set up with Valiko 23/25. Car was very smooth and easy to drive. Thanks to you may have finally found a stand by car to my new Horky with horky 12 mag motor.

all your talk of controllers ahas spurred me on to get used to my new defalco. I've hooked it up to a Koford choke and got some new chips made by Mike read here in the UK. It came with a 180 chip (not much use) and a 148 chip (falcon cars) main purpose of the test was to find a controler to tame my new Horky f1 motor 36/27. I used a new 52 chip with full choke and bingo I can now drive the car. It felt awesome. I ran a new 29 chip for the 32 Es and it felt great. Then moved onto our gp 12 32 saloon class using the 52 chip. it felt great as well. The relay and brake circuit is a real step up from the Kapriwa so I guess I'll be using the defalco from now on. Brai Saunders has been on at me for 6 months to do this. Should have listened earlier but it did require a choke which I have only recently acquired.

OK Pat, more info! Who did the Horky knock off? That's great it's working so well, sounds pretty much like the Speedshop formula...in fact on Sunday I just rebuilt my older Horky with the same motor you describe. Good luck on qualifications. You may want to elaborate on that process a little for those who read this thread....this is qualifying for the British 32 Nats....when is that?

Interesting stuff about controllers, Pat. One of my buddies, GearBear, is testing Difalco controllers right now and says they are great. I may have to try one myself now! Your F1 wind is pretty stout!!! We've been using much softer winds per Richard Mack instructions.... Sounds like your #52 chip really softens the sensitivity then? Hmm, this Difalco sounds kind of like a CZ troller with the chips. I've heard that with that type of controller, often racers kind of settle on a "favorite chip" that seems to work for anything. Good tip on the troller.

For those who didn't know, my daughter living near Mid America Raceway in Naperville has been expecting a child. Baby Andrew born around 6am Chicago time this morning. Smart kid, stayed inside where it's warm during one of the biggest blizzards in Chicago history, then decided to appear this morning on a clear day with the roads all plowed. My wife is still in the air as I write this, landing in about an hour, then she takes a cab to the house. I talked with Dad Mashuli (he's from Rwanda), he was beaming over the phone! It was planned as a home birth with a midwife who lives a few miles away. The midwife said things went perfectly, both baby and mom got through it just fine. It was a short labor time of only about 8 hours or so. I'll be visiting the little guy in April during the USRA Nats.

mccr3328
02-03-2011, 11:12 AM
OK Pat, more info! Who did the Horky knock off? That's great it's working so well, sounds pretty much like the Speedshop formula...in fact on Sunday I just rebuilt my older Horky with the same motor you describe. Good luck on qualifications. You may want to elaborate on that process a little for those who read this thread....this is qualifying for the British 32 Nats....when is that?

Interesting stuff about controllers, Pat. One of my buddies, GearBear, is testing Difalco controllers right now and says they are great. I may have to try one myself now! Your F1 wind is pretty stout!!! We've been using much softer winds per Richard Mack instructions.... Sounds like your #52 chip really softens the sensitivity then? Hmm, this Difalco sounds kind of like a CZ troller with the chips. I've heard that with that type of controller, often racers kind of settle on a "favorite chip" that seems to work for anything. Good tip on the troller.

For those who didn't know, my daughter living near Mid America Raceway in Naperville has been expecting a child. Baby Andrew born around 6am Chicago time this morning. Smart kid, stayed inside where it's warm during one of the biggest blizzards in Chicago history, then decided to appear this morning on a clear day with the roads all plowed. My wife is still in the air as I write this, landing in about an hour, then she takes a cab to the house. I talked with Dad Mashuli (he's from Rwanda), he was beaming over the phone! It was planned as a home birth with a midwife who lives a few miles away. The midwife said things went perfectly, both baby and mom got through it just fine. It was a short labor time of only about 8 hours or so. I'll be visiting the little guy in April during the USRA Nats.

Congratulations Gramps! baby Andrew is indead a smart one Weather here has been awful!
I live Close to Mid America See you at the Nats!:D

GearBear
02-03-2011, 11:17 AM
George,

Congratulations Grampa! :) I know you have been looking forward to this for quite some time! Won't be long and we'll hear that you have taken Andrew to the track for his first race! :)


Pat,

When you say you used a 52 chip, what do you mean by that? As George stated, I have been testing the new HD30 Genesis Difalco. I am pretty happy with it for everything but Euro's. It has taken a LOT of changing of resistors to come up with a series that I like. Since I've been a Speedshop Controller guy for many years, I prefer a fairly linear feel. I've actually got a resistor block setup now that feels a lot like my favorite Speedshop, but it won't work on the Eurosports so I need to do yet more testing.

I've actually created an Excel Spreadsheet to graph the resistor values so that I can see the curve to try to get a better idea of what it should feel like before I get to the track. When I get home tonight I'll see if I can upload the spreadsheet for others to play with. I think maybe I'll start a new thread later in the Controller section to see if we can exchange chip settings with people to find out what people like :)

MantaRay
02-03-2011, 11:21 AM
Re: Difalco Controllers..........DD260 is the Fastest Response Network Kit offering 64 resistance value (2.2 ohm). Do you know what resistors are being used to get 52?
2 ohm resistors would make sense..........but I'm wondering if different resistors are used thru the 29 sockets to achieve 52

BTW...Congratulations Granda George!

Jeff714
02-03-2011, 12:14 PM
OK Pat, more info! Who did the Horky knock off? That's great it's working so well, sounds pretty much like the Speedshop formula...in fact on Sunday I just rebuilt my older Horky with the same motor you describe. Good luck on qualifications. You may want to elaborate on that process a little for those who read this thread....this is qualifying for the British 32 Nats....when is that?

Interesting stuff about controllers, Pat. One of my buddies, GearBear, is testing Difalco controllers right now and says they are great. I may have to try one myself now! Your F1 wind is pretty stout!!! We've been using much softer winds per Richard Mack instructions.... Sounds like your #52 chip really softens the sensitivity then? Hmm, this Difalco sounds kind of like a CZ troller with the chips. I've heard that with that type of controller, often racers kind of settle on a "favorite chip" that seems to work for anything. Good tip on the troller.

For those who didn't know, my daughter living near Mid America Raceway in Naperville has been expecting a child. Baby Andrew born around 6am Chicago time this morning. Smart kid, stayed inside where it's warm during one of the biggest blizzards in Chicago history, then decided to appear this morning on a clear day with the roads all plowed. My wife is still in the air as I write this, landing in about an hour, then she takes a cab to the house. I talked with Dad Mashuli (he's from Rwanda), he was beaming over the phone! It was planned as a home birth with a midwife who lives a few miles away. The midwife said things went perfectly, both baby and mom got through it just fine. It was a short labor time of only about 8 hours or so. I'll be visiting the little guy in April during the USRA Nats.

Congratulations and best wishes!!!

KVAN
02-03-2011, 12:27 PM
Congratulations George, I'm glad to hear Dorothy and baby Andrew are doing well. He already sounds as ambitious as his Grandpa, ready to get started even if he is a week early.

Sounds like a visit is in the cards, maybe you can make it out in a couple weeks ( Feb 18 )and just happen to bring your cars with, I hear there is a race going on that weekend. :)

Reaper802
02-03-2011, 01:04 PM
Congratulations George!

Mic Byrd
02-03-2011, 01:24 PM
Congratulations george Grand kids are great you get to spoil them and suger them up then send them home

Greg N
02-03-2011, 02:54 PM
George,

Congratulations!!!

Gearbear,

I have a newer difalco, tho not the genesis one. For flat tracks I use a 148 chip for falcons thru contenders and an 89 for 12s and ESs. Both chips are linear.

The controller has a 2' to 36' built in relay choke and it works just great for Euros. When I'm running 1/32 F1 I hook up a Bugenis toroid choke, I think at about 24' and add with the relay choke till it feels right. The F1 feels great with the Bugenis choke, even tho I never go above 36' total when using both. I need to test more carefully if the Bugenis choke really makes the car any faster. That said, a Bugenis choke makes a great add-on for F1s and enables one to use more normal chokes for the faster Euros.

I do have a larger heat sink on the transistor, other guys have fans. Without a fan or a larger heat sink, the transistor gets too hot with both 1/32 F1s and 1/32 ESs.

I love my controller.

Does the Genesis board add anything useful for flat track racing?

Greg

Mike K
02-03-2011, 02:55 PM
Congratulations George!

GearBear
02-03-2011, 03:06 PM
Guys,

Let's move the Difalco controller talk over to the controller thead (http://www.slotcartalk.com/slotcartalk/showthread.php?30572-Difalco-HD30-Custom-Resistor-Blocks-How-do-you-have-yours-set-up&highlight=) so we don't get George's thread too far off topic ;).

As for Chokes for Eurosport. My Speedshop has a rotary switch controlled choke with a full throttle bypass relay built in. I rarely use more than 9ft of choke with this controller (my switch advances the choke 3ft for each position). The choke is a wire wound choke on an aluminum tube. I'm not sure what gauge wire Alex used to build the choke, but more than 12ft will drastically delay the controller response. So, 3-6ft of choke is usually enough to drive just about any Euro. If I get up to 12ft, it usually means the car is not handling well and I'm searching for a magic bullet that I don't have!

I now have a week to get my cars ready for the next series race. In that time I'm going to have to rebuild 2 Euro motors, rebuild a Contender motor, paint 4 bodies, and do some chassis work on my flexi cars. Gonna be a busy weekend for sure!

MantaRay
02-03-2011, 04:03 PM
George,

I do have a larger heat sink on the transistor, other guys have fans. Without a fan or a larger heat sink, the transistor gets too hot with both 1/32 F1s and 1/32 ESs.

I love my controller.

Greg

The Heat Sink Block on Greg's Controller is so large that it has a VIN Number

patraceruk
02-03-2011, 04:06 PM
OK Pat, more info! Who did the Horky knock off? That's great it's working so well, sounds pretty much like the Speedshop formula...in fact on Sunday I just rebuilt my older Horky with the same motor you describe. Good luck on qualifications. You may want to elaborate on that process a little for those who read this thread....this is qualifying for the British 32 Nats....when is that?

Interesting stuff about controllers, Pat. One of my buddies, GearBear, is testing Difalco controllers right now and says they are great. I may have to try one myself now! Your F1 wind is pretty stout!!! We've been using much softer winds per Richard Mack instructions.... Sounds like your #52 chip really softens the sensitivity then? Hmm, this Difalco sounds kind of like a CZ troller with the chips. I've heard that with that type of controller, often racers kind of settle on a "favorite chip" that seems to work for anything. Good tip on the troller.

Andrew

For those who didn't know, my daughter living near Mid America Raceway in Naperville has been expecting a child. Baby Andrew born around 6am Chicago time this morning. Smart kid, stayed inside where it's warm during one of the biggest blizzards in Chicago history, then decided to appear this morning on a clear day with the roads all plowed. My wife is still in the air as I write this, landing in about an hour, then she takes a cab to the house. I talked with Dad Mashuli (he's from Rwanda), he was beaming over the phone! It was planned as a home birth with a midwife who lives a few miles away. The midwife said things went perfectly, both baby and mom got through it just fine. It was a short labor time of only about 8 hours or so. I'll be visiting the little guy in April during the USRA Nats.

Congrats George.

Andrew, a great Scottish name, now you have a real excuse to open that Malt!!!

The Horky motor was one I got from Vladimir at the worlds. I ran it but used the wrong setting on my controller not having had time to fully understand the set up. It has a fairly narrow power band hence the lower chip.

You have to qualify for our BSCRA 32 Nats. The UK is split into areas which hold qualifying rounds. I'm in area 1 which is Scotland. We have 3 rounds for our 32 classes F1 Eurosport and Group 12 saloon. The number of places each area gets depends on the number of BSCRA members. Last year we got 4 places so the competition is fierce.

In answer to the controller query. I know nothing about electronics. The Defalco chip numbers bare no resemblance to that on a Pro2 or 3 or kapriwa for that matter. I don't think Defalco make anything lower than a 140 which is a bit strange when you consider how hot some strap motors are these days.

Reaper802
02-03-2011, 04:48 PM
George, did those carbon fiber hubs show up yet? Very interested to hear how they work out.

Slotcar Racer
02-03-2011, 08:41 PM
Thanks for all the well wishes on young Andrew. Thanks Pat for explaining the BSCRA 32 Nats to us. The last time I recall such qualifying was in 1965 in the San Francisco Bay Area for the Montgomery Ward Championship. I qualified at San Leandro Speedway and I still have my First Place plaque in my box....in fact, I use it for my lane stickers. Rocky, I haven't gotten the carbon fibre hubs yet, I'll contact Paul and try to get a date on that....should be soon though. Yeah, I am looking forward to it. I like reading about controllers...as far as I'm concerned write all you want about it. I need to check baby pictures on Facebook, then I need to get into the shop and work on my GT12s for Frank's race coming up on the 12th. Two new motors to try out. Better go now....

Slotcar Racer
02-04-2011, 09:41 AM
Got one of the 45* BOW G12 arms loaded up in one of the new Cahoza set ups. I'm not happy with the way it's running on the analyzer, it is not running smoothly, kind of oscillating in rpm. I tried rehoning the brushes thinking maybe some bad material. That didn't work. Tonight I am going to pull that set of brushes and try another pair. If still the same problem, I'll move that arm to another set up and see if it is the arm or the set up. I had run this arm through a few heat cycles, then sent out for balance. Feels nice and smooth for balance, but not maintaining constant speed. The other set up I built has a rebalanced Koford G12 and it is smooth as a babie's butt.....why did I just say that?

Slotcar Racer
02-05-2011, 09:57 AM
This morning I mounted brand new motor into my Mack Tazer prototype chassis. Everything went great until I tightened the set screw on the wheel opposite the gear. It's a motor you can't feel when it's running the balance is so good, a Cahoza 42T 16* angled spur, 8T pinion, Cahoza axle. OK, before putting the wheel on, I tried it on the analyzer and it was smooth as silk. You couldn't feel it running and nice quiet sound. Put wheel on opposite side, do not tighten set screw, now run it....same result, beautiful. Now, tighten the set screw....all of a sudden a harmonic vibration that is bad at lower rpm, smoothes out at higher rpm. Next, try resetting motor for a slightly looser gear mesh....same result. !?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?

Next step....pulled the motor and the rear axle and switched it to Bulldog #1 which is set up for a 40T straight cut spur. Got that slapped together and it was all fine....smooth as can be. So right now, I have just finished pulling the bushings from the Tazer and put in bearings for the Nats. Will try another motor soon and see if it works smoothly. It may have been the bushings in the Tazer.

Mic Byrd
02-05-2011, 10:38 AM
George I know you said you like the way the tazer works with motor angle I have mine set up to run falter with as little angle as possible and bearings in the rear i took a little of the preload out of the spine and I love it .now only if I could drive it as good as the car is no doubt it would be on the podium.almost made it from b main. Your vibration sounds like the bushing for sure.

Mic Byrd
02-05-2011, 10:42 AM
Got one of the 45* BOW G12 arms loaded up in one of the new Cahoza set ups. I'm not happy with the way it's running on the analyzer, it is not running smoothly, kind of oscillating in rpm. I tried rehoning the brushes thinking maybe some bad material. That didn't work. Tonight I am going to pull that set of brushes and try another pair. If still the same problem, I'll move that arm to another set up and see if it is the arm or the set up. I had run this arm through a few heat cycles, then sent out for balance. Feels nice and smooth for balance, but not maintaining constant speed. The other set up I built has a rebalanced Koford G12 and it is smooth as a babie's butt.....why did I just say that?
George
I have a .540 dia BOW 12 45 degree and it ran the same way you disscribed ran it in a couple of setups and same thing sent it out for balancing and its better but not great.would like to hear your progress with it

Slotcar Racer
02-05-2011, 11:15 AM
Mic, I put the same armature that was running kind of strangely into a big ol' stinkin' Kelly 4 hole set up with T5s (the nuclear option motor set up) and it was just fine. Go figure. Put a different BOW armature (2nd of 2 that I got from PSCR) into the set up that was not working with the other arm. It was just fine. Go figure again. All I can figure is, the combination of armature and set up did not work, so try a different combination until it works. This brings us back to the concept that slotcars work according to the tides, planetary alignment, location of nearest solar system, etc

For the Tazer, Richard Mack sent me the one he and his team ran in their 24 Hour Enduro last year and it is set up for 42T spur with the non adjustable pillow blocks. It was absolutely fantastic at the last race at SCR, just underpowered. It handled better than a Bulldog in the esses....almost full punch, amazing. And yes, it was the bushings. I put in bearings, and then mounted the Kelly set up mentioned above, got both wheels on it and it is smooth as glass. I'll remember the bushing issue in the future. Gotta go, time for grocery shopping.

Greg N
02-05-2011, 03:41 PM
Actually, I was going to suggest that it was the bushing, an oversized axle hole in the rim, or a badly out of balance wheel. But that would have applied to my stuff. George doesn't have any out of balance or poorly drilled wheels! :-)

George, I love this thread, thanks!!

Greg

Slotcar Racer
02-05-2011, 07:11 PM
Greg, you're welcome my friend.

Just back from SCR, testing was not to my liking, I think the 8T pinions I tried are not the right ratio. We've always used 7T pinions, but lately trying the 8T for more speed, but my motors were really lugging this afternoon. Hermanator was there too, we got together his parts for his cars....race next Saturday. I don't know why we tried such a high gear ratio before, we'd always been good with the 7T, but today it had all the bad symptoms of a too tall ratio....motor never peaked out, sounded kind of labored, handling all crazy. OK, the 7T pinions are going back on tonight and I'll have to burn up some more $3.39 gasoline for another 80 miles tomorrow to test again. On top of it all, it is way, way, way too hot out here. It was 70 degrees today, I had to roll my window down and that caused me to turn NPR up louder than I wanted to....really inconvenient this heat. The big beagle has a lot of black fur on his back, and he got really hot on the 2 mile walk this morning. I sure hope this heat wave ends soon, it is wearing me out. Gotta go.

Mic Byrd
02-06-2011, 06:52 AM
George
I feel for ya we in jersey have a heat wave going on to its 37 right now and climbing LOL. Have to build 4 motors today I should get started on baking mags.

ab slotsport
02-06-2011, 08:19 AM
Wow you guys have it tough in the States. Gas @ $3.39 a gallon? In the UK we buy fuel by the Litre and right now Diesel is 1.31 , thats around 5.90 per gallon, convert that to US$ and its $9.15 for a gallon. Just glad I drive a Diesel turbo that gives me 50MPG!

Talking about vibration, We run cahoza 42t 16deg gears here and have found a difference in mesh with different manufacturer pinions, especially 7's. Camen and ARP seem to work well with the gear, some others not as smooth. For everyday racing I'm too mean to use EDM's, so pinion choice is important to get a good, smooth mesh. Oh joy, now it's time to return to the workshop! It's 10 gerees C here and chucking it down with rain! enjoy you heat wave!
Andy BS

Slotcar Racer
02-07-2011, 10:56 AM
Yesterday 24 temperature records broken in the SF Bay Area. Went to SCR and it was 83* and very nice. This test session reaffirmed one thing, my G12 motors do not like to lug with 8T pinions, they like to spin freely with the 7T pinions. Next I need to open up the airgaps and go back to what has worked before. I tried one of the new Cahoza set ups at 530, but obviously I need to go back to the usual 535 (this is for Koford 518 arms). I've had a little success in the past with the wide airgap, but I thought it was time to go back and try tighter airgaps again. It just seems to slow down the armature, and the increased torque with higher gearing only makes it handle terribly. Oh well, it is always worth the effort to reaffirm where we are currently.

Mic Byrd
02-07-2011, 05:02 PM
Just finished 3 cahoza builds 1 12 1 sw 1 cont the 12 and sw have to come apart looks like the brand new slick 7 bearings are bad .My racer will just have to pay me for my bearings at 1/2 the cost. back to the bench

Slotcar Racer
02-07-2011, 05:33 PM
Just finished 3 cahoza builds 1 12 1 sw 1 cont the 12 and sw have to come apart looks like the brand new slick 7 bearings are bad .My racer will just have to pay me for my bearings at 1/2 the cost. back to the bench

I get my bearings from Dave Liebenthal. Great quality, even better price. Slotcar Racer, The Pricer. Gotta go home.

multiracer
02-07-2011, 05:42 PM
I have tried every offshore/asian bearing on the market and the genuine GRW in the blister package is the only bearing that will give you the expected performance and life for the money.
You will not be unhappy and the results will be evident after you install the first one. :p :p :p

Mic Byrd
02-07-2011, 06:17 PM
George I also get my c can bearing from Dave and have for a few years
Ron I do use grw bearings in my euro motors and your right wouldn't use any other bearing in a euro motor but c cans are just fine with Dave L bearings haven't got a bad 1 yet
The friend I'm building for had all the bearings from his tracks stock.Which closed its doors about 1 week ago.

Mic Byrd
02-08-2011, 08:52 AM
home nursing a cold had a chance to work on the 12 and s wasp motors it turns out its not the bearings but something with the arms. when you rev them at about 6 volts they shake and you see the arm jump then it seems to smooth out a bit.bad balance out of round what do you think?Cut com on 12 it was alittle coned but not to bad.the 12 moves so much the arm hits 1 stack on magnet put different arm in set up and its fine.

mazur50
02-08-2011, 09:07 AM
home nursing a cold had a chance to work on the 12 and s wasp motors it turns out its not the bearings but something with the arms. when you rev them at about 6 volts they shake and you see the arm jump then it seems to smooth out a bit.bad balance out of round what do you think?Cut com on 12 it was alittle coned but not to bad.the 12 moves so much the arm hits 1 stack on magnet put different arm in set up and its fine.

When was the last time they where balanced.

Also did they happen to ever spin a pinion. That can put a arm out of balance really fast if it is over revved.

I would also check the arm on a run out gauge to make sure the shaft is not bent.

Mike

Slotcar Racer
02-08-2011, 09:59 AM
Sorry to hear you aren't feeling so hot today Mic. Last night I almost finished Hermantor's Tazer GT12. That chassis is quite an easy build. For the motor I used the UL can, PS endbell kit (best buy), Koford mags and a Koford G12 arm balanced by Beuf. One thing I noticed was the Champion red springs look different. The Champion lights have always had a red material of some kind that usually comes off pretty easily, almost like some kind of paint that makes the springs look nice and red when they are displayed on the header card, but after you use them a while all the brightness wears off (but they still work fine). The springs I used last night for Hermantor's mill looked and felt very different to me. For one thing, the red does not look painted, it looks more like a metal coating of some kind, a dye, or even a sort of anodyzed look. Also, the spring material itself did not feel as springy as older pairs. I am wondering if they changed them....has anybody else noticed this? It's the first time I've seen the springs like this. They are almost imposter Champion springs. I've been trying the Cahoza three coils springs and they seem OK, but the Champion light has always been the best spring for C Can motors in my opinion. Any other experiences out there to verify what I saw last night? Anyway, I should have that GT12 finished tonight and I can get going on rebuilding his two eurosport motors.....one for the 2010 Mack prototype and the other for Horky's 2009 winning chassis he bought from Tony Sr. at the Worlds. Gotta go now...

wbugenis
02-08-2011, 11:01 AM
George
I have a .540 dia BOW 12 45 degree and it ran the same way you disscribed ran it in a couple of setups and same thing sent it out for balancing and its better but not great.would like to hear your progress with it

Measure the O.D. on the three stacks and make sure they are the same. Grinding 0.020" off a 0.560" blank to 0.540" requires a serious grinder and you will get different measurements without one. Bring the arm up to the ISRA race this weekend and we will O.D. grind it as you need to be doing with euro arms whenever they are reconditioned. It does no harm to do this with 12 and contender arms as well.

Bill

Mic Byrd
02-08-2011, 11:39 AM
When was the last time they where balanced.

Also did they happen to ever spin a pinion. That can put a arm out of balance really fast if it is over revved.

I would also check the arm on a run out gauge to make sure the shaft is not bent.

Mike
Mike the arms are new out of the package . it looks like nthe stacks are out. Will pull them apart and take bill up on his offer.

Mike K
02-08-2011, 12:59 PM
Mr SR Sir-

back to the tazer.....what size rear tires are you using with the non adjustable pillow blocks?
thx.mk

Slotcar Racer
02-08-2011, 05:41 PM
Mike, it looks like the nonadjustables are for a 42 Tooth, 72 pitch 16* angle spur AKA a .670" tire.

Mike K
02-08-2011, 07:12 PM
Thank you. I built my first tazer that way but I guess I'm not used to running that small of a tire. It IS really hooked up though. The second tazer with taller tires not so much so. Might be worth it to change the axle height.

Mic Byrd
02-09-2011, 05:00 AM
Thank you. I built my first tazer that way but I guess I'm not used to running that small of a tire. It IS really hooked up though. The second tazer with taller tires not so much so. Might be worth it to change the axle height.
Mike K .I have my tazer setup with the adjustable and set for 43t I start at .680 and car has been great throught 2 races. 1thing you can check is the spine on top of the center rail compare it to first chassis and ajust . I have some preload in it and I couldn't be happier with it .

Slotcar Racer
02-09-2011, 09:32 AM
I got the Horky eurosport built up but had a lot of trouble with that motor. It's a regular Speedshop small block, looks like it used to be in a Speedshop chassis cuz it has a solder joint in the front and the back and the can tab is cut off. It's the PK arm in there that scares me, the stacks are peeling away at the corners and I can feel sharpness...I hope they don't lift and grenade the magnets. The motor for the Mack prototype, on the other hand, is an 18 mag Gulliver with Camen arm. I rebuilt it last night and put in a new can bearing and it really sounds sweet. The Gulliver class motors have a unique scream. That motor plugged into the Mack very nicely. Tonight all I need to do is get a couple of Audi R10s mounted on those two cars and our team will be ready for the races on Saturday at SCR. Better go now...

wbugenis
02-09-2011, 10:46 AM
I got the Horky eurosport built up but had a lot of trouble with that motor. It's a regular Speedshop small block, looks like it used to be in a Speedshop chassis cuz it has a solder joint in the front and the back and the can tab is cut off. It's the PK arm in there that scares me, the stacks are peeling away at the corners and I can feel sharpness...I hope they don't lift and grenade the magnets. The motor for the Mack prototype, on the other hand, is an 18 mag Gulliver with Camen arm. I rebuilt it last night and put in a new can bearing and it really sounds sweet. The Gulliver class motors have a unique scream. That motor plugged into the Mack very nicely. Tonight all I need to do is get a couple of Audi R10s mounted on those two cars and our team will be ready for the races on Saturday at SCR. Better go now...

George,

You will alleviate the movement of the lams on your PK arm if you have it O.D. ground each time you have it reconditioned. I learned from the Czech team at the Worlds this is standard procedure for their PK arms. They love their PK arms.

Slotcar Racer
02-09-2011, 12:17 PM
Bill, I'm not sure how touching up the arm stacks will help alleviate the movement. All I can see is it would knock off the tips of the bent out stack corners that are sticking up. Makes sense to do this and have it rebalanced, but it sure would be nice if the corners of the stacks didn't lift in the first place. I haven't seen it with Camen and Valiko arms which is what I mostly use. Actually I have a PK 19t25 right now that is really good, and this has not happened to the stacks. I've put quite a few runs on it too.

wbugenis
02-09-2011, 12:35 PM
Bill, I'm not sure how touching up the arm stacks will help alleviate the movement. All I can see is it would knock off the tips of the bent out stack corners that are sticking up. Makes sense to do this and have it rebalanced, but it sure would be nice if the corners of the stacks didn't lift in the first place. I haven't seen it with Camen and Valiko arms which is what I mostly use. Actually I have a PK 19t25 right now that is really good, and this has not happened to the stacks. I've put quite a few runs on it too.

Just reporting on what Vladimir and the boys do - they don't seem to have issues. On euro arms that I make, we noted that they swell about 0.0005" after the first run, less and less after that. We have been O.D. grinding at each teardown.

GearBear
02-09-2011, 03:18 PM
Bill, interesting comment on the laminations. Usually I don't see this happening unless I have had a magnet break and it strikes the edge of the stack as it let's go.

I love my PK arms! I have never had a bad one. I have worn out too many of them though!

wbugenis
02-09-2011, 03:36 PM
Bill, interesting comment on the laminations. Usually I don't see this happening unless I have had a magnet break and it strikes the edge of the stack as it let's go.

I love my PK arms! I have never had a bad one. I have worn out too many of them though!

I know it seems counter-intuitive, but it looks as though controling the small movements seems to also limit the gross movement that George describes. We spit some lams before we started grinding but none since. Not conclusive, but as good an inference as we can make.

Bill

Slotcar Racer
02-10-2011, 09:29 AM
Last night got two R10s mounted on Hermanator's eurosports, both mounts went without any technical protests. So, all his stuff is done and now on to my cars. Mine is pretty much ready to go, I just tested it on Sunday. The only thing I want to do is pull a really stout motor out of another GT12 and put the lump into my Tazer. The Tazer works so well on Frank's Testarossa that I really haven't come close to overpowering that chassis. As it is, there is so much of the track punched I think it could use more horsepower. Even the esses over on the right side of the track are practically full punch. When this race is over, I'm going to put a eurosport motor in the Tazer to see how it runs. I asked Richard if he had any plans to make a Tazer eurosport with modified cobalt rear section. I have tried a euro motor in a Bulldog and it ran 3.3s on the Testarossa, only .3 off the Mack eurosport. Anyway, I digress, just need to load the faster lump into the Tazer then go up there on Saturday. Wife is out of town, so I will have to feed the beagles around 2:30pm and leave for the rest of the day. Better get going now...

Mike K
02-10-2011, 10:03 AM
How many beagles??

Mic Byrd
02-10-2011, 02:13 PM
got most of my cars ready will be racing N.E Isra at Lou Pirro's on the Isra N.A Championship track to bad surface is not done yet will have to make 1 more trip before July after track is resurfaced.Good luck all

Slotcar Racer
02-10-2011, 04:14 PM
How many beagles??


<a href="http://www.flickr.com/photos/56038309@N08/5434882092/" title="The Beagles by svtgeorge, on Flickr"><img src="http://farm6.static.flickr.com/5060/5434882092_6c5017b54b_s.jpg" width="75" height="75" alt="The Beagles" /></a>

mazur50
02-10-2011, 04:27 PM
Brink them to the nats.

Berteinstein
02-10-2011, 07:09 PM
George-
A wise man once told me- "beagles are for feeding and bagels are for eatin'n" It is easy to remember because if you feed the bagel, it won't eat!
Anon

Slotcar Racer
02-11-2011, 09:33 AM
Jason, you don't know how true that saying is! Last night, I put a different motor into the Tazer. Interesting motor, a four hole Kelly, Koford magnets at 535 and a Koford arm at 38 degrees. The lower timing is a bit unusual for me, I normally run at least 40 degrees. But, this seems to move the car along very quickly. We'll see how it runs tomorrow. Also need to switch around some stuff for 24 Euro, I'm pulling the PK 95 out of the new Camen 455T single mag set up and going to pop it into the new Camen 480T single mag set up...I haven't tried that combo yet...I'll put that in the Chicago Horky chassis. Looking forward to racing tomorrow!

Mic Byrd
02-11-2011, 11:18 AM
Slotcar Racer
on your tazer do you have it built with the guide spacer in or out . I have to use a full size guide because of the spacer was wondering if you took it out could you then use a cut down?

Slotcar Racer
02-14-2011, 09:30 AM
Saturday night racing at Slot Car Raceway, Rohnert Park, Calif., I had the "variety pack", 1st, 2nd and 3rd. GT12 got 1st, Eurosport got 2nd, 32 Euro got 3rd. I was real happy with both GT12 and 24 Euro, but 32 Euro was not very good. I'll start with 32 Euro and get it out of the way first.

We had only six entries in 32 Euro. PG and I ran the ISRA body, the others ran the Reynard high downforce, so PG and I showed up with butter knives at a gunfight. I ran my back up car, not my Nats/Worlds car. It was a shake down for the rebuilt practice car, I wanted to see how she went after cleaning it up. I did freshen up the Worlds motor and it was stout. PG ran Piero's new chassis. I think I'll need one of those, it seemed to have massive grip with the low downforce body. My old Horky was just loose, loose, loose, especially with tall tires. I probably should have put on small tires after the first heat (we did not follow ISRA procedures!) because by the last two heats on low tires the car was really good. PG won, Jason got 2nd with my 2006 Nats car (Mosetti) I came in third. On tall tires, I came off too many times especially in the first heat. And on the red lane, the car would just launch going into the donut, a place where normally you should be able to punch it all the way around to the “90”. I didn't wreck with anyone, mostly my own offs…my bad.

In GT12 I used the Tazer with a motor I pulled out of an old Slick 7 chassis. I’m still wondering why I did that, it was a terrible motor! It did 3.73 on yellow when I got there for practice, but with 8 cars on the track it died. However, the Tazer is so good, I could practically punch the whole track and it stayed on really well....even an imbecile like me could drive it. I also tested Bulldog #1 when I got there, but it was too tight and did strange helicopter acrobatics. A lot of guys thought the track too tight, I saw other cars doing crazy back flips too! Anyway, as is often the case, as the race was a round robin, it was not clear who the contenders were until a few heats from the end and I knew I would be in the hunt, but as is often the case, Ryan McDaniel was leading by two laps with two heats to go. He started the next to last heat on orange, and I was on green. I held him off, he never passed me in that heat. Then, I went to blue and he went to white. I had to get it done in three minutes and I did it by 10 feet when the bell rang!! Cool win, good race, Ryan is a great competitor...watch for him at the Scale Nats

The 24 Euro race was awesome. Chris Chakires won, me 2nd, Jason 3rd....all three running the ubiquitous new Horky chassis!! Herman did reasonably well with his Finland Horky, but something must have happened that I still haven’t figured out. His car was blazing fast on orange. Chakires was running a freshened up Lee Gilbert car with the Speedshop “Mystery Motor”...a vertical multi magnet configuration. I don’t know what Jason had for a motor, but it was stout and he is a very fine eurosport racer. I just got out horsepowered slightly by the Mystery Motor, not by much, but enough to lose a lap per heat going when he was running two lanes inside of me…he started black and I started yellow...we were side by side a lot of the first heat, I was pulling him a little which I know made him push really hard. I knew I had reserve for the end when the tires went down and ran 9 feet in the first two heats. Chris and I drove good clean races without too many wrecks. I ran my new 480 tall single mag Camen set up with a PK 19t25 arm reconditioned by Camen. Coming down from red, I could pull him slightly, so he started to drive the wheels off his car keeping up with me with eight more feet of track to cover. As a result, in the last heat, I was on black, he was on purple and he had blown his tires off and was falling off. But he held it together and won in the end….reminded me a bit of Greg Gilbert’s 32 Euro win. Even though I got beat, it was a good honest 2nd place, Chris was on his game and he had a fast Lee Gilbert freshened car...oh yeah, I forgot, he ran the big long Audi R10….I used the ISRA body….oh well….gotta go.

Slotcar Racer
02-14-2011, 09:38 AM
Slotcar Racer
on your tazer do you have it built with the guide spacer in or out . I have to use a full size guide because of the spacer was wondering if you took it out could you then use a cut down?

Mic, not sure what you mean. I just use a cut down guide on my Tazer with no spacers at all. On Frank's track, you want any Mack chassis to pretty much be .005" above the track...they work a lot better slammed.

Mic Byrd
02-14-2011, 11:27 AM
Mic, not sure what you mean. I just use a cut down guide on my Tazer with no spacers at all. On Frank's track, you want any Mack chassis to pretty much be .005" above the track...they work a lot better slammed.
the UK black I run on has .015 braid recess with cut down flag I still need .020 of spacers to get ride height. So it seems my tazer sits a little higher then yours . the chassis works great once I get it right but seamed odd to me because my mack open 12 chassis need no spacers for same track.

GearBear
02-14-2011, 01:00 PM
Nice write up on the racing George! Sounds like your 24 Euro race went about like mine. Alicia kicked my butt again! See my write up in the PSCR series thread.

Slotcar Racer
02-14-2011, 01:10 PM
the UK black I run on has .015 braid recess with cut down flag I still need .020 of spacers to get ride height. So it seems my tazer sits a little higher then yours . the chassis works great once I get it right but seamed odd to me because my mack open 12 chassis need no spacers for same track.

Mic, it sounds to me like the guide tongue angle may be different between the two chassis, that usually accounts for a lot of it.

Mic Byrd
02-14-2011, 01:25 PM
Mic, it sounds to me like the guide tongue angle may be different between the two chassis, that usually accounts for a lot of it.
Thank you will check that

Mic Byrd
02-14-2011, 02:04 PM
1 more thing 2 degrees up is the right angle ? Thanks for all your help making a better builder 1 question at a time LOL

Zippity
02-14-2011, 03:22 PM
Damn it!!!

What is this Tazer thing you keep talking about? :(

Have you got a link to a photo of the offending beast? please??

:)

GearBear
02-14-2011, 03:46 PM
Zip, take a look at this thread (http://www.slotcartalk.com/slotcartalk/showthread.php?23978-Mack-GT12-Chassis&p=253133), post #27. You can also see it on the Mack website. http://www.mackslotracing.com/

Zippity
02-14-2011, 03:57 PM
Thanks Gary.

Much appreciated :)

Slotcar Racer
02-14-2011, 04:59 PM
Top three cars from Saturday night, the Tazer is in the middle surrounded by Bulldogs. Woof.<a href="http://www.flickr.com/photos/56038309@N08/5446733056/" title="013-6 by svtgeorge, on Flickr"><img src="http://farm6.static.flickr.com/5017/5446733056_14e3b73784.jpg" width="500" height="375" alt="013-6" /></a>

Slotcar Racer
02-15-2011, 09:45 AM
Time to change gears once again, now working on NORCAL stuff and I already know I’m spreading myself too thin. In the past I have only raced flat track classes, namely LMP and GT12. Now, with the next race at Modesto, I am putting together a 4” NASCAR and……..a 4.5” TRUCK!! Jerry sent Frank S some 4.5” Cheetah 7s maybe about three years ago, they had big vintage bodies on them and we had a big race one Saturday. Since then, we’ve been using this same chassis for 4.5” NASCAR with Falcon motors on Frank’s blue king. Mine has been sitting in my box for a couple of years, so I pulled it out, took off the car body and removed the Falcon. I had to build up the front wheel diameter from .750” to .790” using super glue, that worked well. Next, I put in one of my Kelly set ups with the old Viper .560” 16D arm. CRASH said to gear the thing 12:44 with 72 pitch. With minimum rear tire diameter of .790” I’m going back in time. So, let’s see, I need to make a set of jig wheels .665” diameter to set my chassis at .063” clearance with .790 tires. OK, I think I have something lying around to do that. Wow, this kind of thinking is way different from three days ago when I was racing a Horky eurosport!!! Well, I better get to work tonight when I get home. Got a Ford truck body painted last night. Gotta go…

Slotcar Racer
02-16-2011, 09:09 AM
<a href="http://www.flickr.com/photos/56038309@N08/5450633051/" title="DSCN4020 by svtgeorge, on Flickr"><img src="http://farm6.static.flickr.com/5295/5450633051_76dd5a61c2.jpg" width="500" height="375" alt="DSCN4020" /></a>

Well, I finally stopped procrastinating about gluing up tires, got them all mounted on my mini axles, 28 pairs, glued and tonight they get dipped in thinner and the donuts mounted on the rims. I'm doing 15 pairs of the carbon fiber hubs, I think half a dozen .500" diameter Speedshop hubs, and the balance are just regular .400" diameter Speedshop hubs, this in preparation for the upcoming NORCAL race at TNT Raceway in Modesto. Also got the front end installed on my 4.5" truck, it requires .790" diameter front tires, so I had to fiddle around a little to get them even with the bottom of the chassis, I don't want those stupid things interfering with the chassis doing it's own work. Put in the new Pro Slot 16D with the .560" arm, geared 72 pitch 12:44. Better go now...

oldweirdherald
02-16-2011, 09:28 AM
Slotcar Racer...

You are much too neat... that picture of your work area is not inspiring, it is actually a bit depressing.
(at least to us mere mortals and self-professed slobs amongst us) :p

I don't even see any signs of glue spillage or gluey fingerprints anywhere... :(

I want to see a picture of your workbench AFTER you finish cutting all those tires! (and BEFORE you clean it all up again)

Let's see some good old black rubber dust on those glasses at least!

For crying out loud... your wastebasket is even empty. :eek:

:p

PK

Slotcar Racer
02-16-2011, 10:50 AM
OWH, I'm gonna come clean with you....that's my computer area in our office, not my work bench. My work bench has so much stuff scattered all over it I couldn't fit my tire board on it....the white surface in the office made a better photo background, and I just uploaded the photo right after taking the picture.

Slotcar Racer
02-16-2011, 12:51 PM
Getting back to the tire making, the rims are mounted to short 3/32" piano wire axles, only about 1.5" long. The next step is reactivating the glue in lacquer thinner. I saw the fancy device on another thread, however I just take a pair of hot dog tongs (the one my wife used to use to take hot dogs out of the boiling water.....now she doesn't use it anymore) and grab a donut out of the wooden box (refer to photo), dip it in the thinner, hold the rim by the axle and slide it in the donut. This way I do not even touch the thinner which I cannot imagine is a very good chemical for skin contact. The process is really fast, I'll probably have these 28 pairs done in about 15 minutes.

Slotcar Racer
02-17-2011, 09:22 AM
Got the donuts mounted last night right after getting to work. I'm going to let these set up for two days because both CRASH and Hermanator said they will grind down easier the longer they cure. So on Friday night, the plan is to install the "HOGGER" to the Hudy tire truer and do rough cuts. I've cut a small square hole in one of my COSTCO cheap tables. The square opening under the tire truer fits over the hole in the table and the rubber crumbs drop straight down into a container.

Also finished up the 4.5" truck and got the body mounted. I decided to go with a Brazilian 16D set up with the angle tip mags, and put in the old Viper .560" arm and geared 72 pitch 12:44. Also got the new PS motor installed in the 4" NASCAR and got the body pinned. Tonight I need to finish the bullet proofing on the NASCAR body, then install interiors on the truck and the car.

I hope to install a new set of Koford 3/32" axle bearings into a new Horky chassis that has never been built before. This will be the #2 Horky and as I said will be a 3/32" axle car instead of the usual 2mm. I can try out the Cahoza carbon fiber hubs on this car and see how I like it. The 2mm car can also be converted back to 3/32", but because the bearing holes have been enlarged a few thou it get's a little tricky...will need to align rear end and use gears for jig wheels. Better go now, time for "work"...

KVAN
02-17-2011, 08:48 PM
Slotcar Racer, I had planned to ask what you used to rough cut the tires down to a more workable size. You referred to the "HOGGER" in your last post, now my question is, what is the "HOGGER"?


PS. We miss you at the masters today! Are you sure that new grandson doesn't need to see his Grandpa?

Slotcar Racer
02-18-2011, 09:29 AM
Slotcar Racer, I had planned to ask what you used to rough cut the tires down to a more workable size. You referred to the "HOGGER" in your last post, now my question is, what is the "HOGGER"?

PS. We miss you at the masters today! Are you sure that new grandson doesn't need to see his Grandpa?

Thanks Kevin, I miss you guys too. In fact, I am not so much feeling like the true Slotcar Racer by missing the Masters, however I will be expanding my Scale Nats exploits by two days....now planning to race F1, 32 Euro, GT12 and 24 Euro. And yes, Grandson does need to see the Geezer. Do well Kevin, I'll be watching the live feed.

Last night finished mounting the truck, NASCAR and HD Caddy bodies....race ready....it feels good to finish the NORCAL cars.

Tonight I get the 28 pairs of tires out of the garage and start burning set screw holes, then whack off the inside and outside extra rubber, then get out the HOGGER. God I love that wheel! Kevin, the HOGGER is the rough diamond wheel for the Hudy Tire Truer that David Liebenthal manufactures. Regor had some in his counter at the Worlds. I recommend it, I can take a full sized donut on rim down to .700" in about 20 seconds. Takes no prisoners. Cut a square hole in a cheap table, position the Hudy over the hole, put a waste container under table and grind away! Better get to "work". Hurray, it's Friday!!!!!

"Dub" Wade
02-18-2011, 12:39 PM
David Liebenthal, is Proformance correct? How do you get the Hogger?

Slotcar Racer
02-18-2011, 01:51 PM
David Liebenthal, is Proformance correct? How do you get the Hogger?

http://www.proformanceracing.biz/vcom/product_info.php?cPath=78&products_id=487

Dustyn, I believe David has a very reasonable raceway discount, so give him a call.

Slotcar Racer, Over and Out

Slotcar Racer
02-19-2011, 12:28 PM
I put the HOGGER away a few hours ago, got 28 pairs rough cut. The new Speedshop rubber I got is really hard, even the Hogger was working hard. But the Piranhas cut like butter. Once all the rough cuts were bagged up and marked, I pulled out the new Horky chassis and readjusted the pans. With some practice this procedure has become easier and I eventually got the pans to lift simultaneously with the center section. Next, I installed a new pair of Koford axle bearings, rear axle and a Cahoza 44T 80 pitch 3/32" axle gear. At the front end, put in a new Koford guide which I sanded down a lot to get the front of the car as low as possible.

Right now the tall block, the 480 tall single set up, is breaking in a Valiko 22t24.5, so I'm getting pretty close to finishing it up. I'll probably leave for SCR around 1:00pm. Lots of rain in the Bay Area, I don't think much of a chance of getting the beagles out, but maybe a short neighborhood walk before I leave for Rohnert Park. Testing report following tomorrow.

Slotcar Racer
02-19-2011, 12:38 PM
This is what beagles do on a cold, rainy day when they cannot go out for a walk....
<a href="http://www.flickr.com/photos/56038309@N08/5458772637/" title="DSCN4025 by svtgeorge, on Flickr"><img src="http://farm6.static.flickr.com/5175/5458772637_c29e28c50b.jpg" width="500" height="375" alt="DSCN4025" /></a>

Slotcar Racer
02-20-2011, 12:13 PM
The testing went really well yesterday. The new 16D in my 4" NASCAR is a monster, really makes a lot of power. I didn't have the right rubber on the car (too hard) and the tires were way big, but still managed some 4.94s.

The Truck needs more brakes, the Brazilian angle tip mags just aren't creating enough braking for that big ol brick. Even with the lack of brakes, it ran consistent 5.4s and one 5.38 hare lap. So, I built another Pro Slot set up last night and brushed the comm on the old RJR 16D arm....will probably go up again today and try it.

I'm in good shape with GT12, the older Bulldog has a good stout motor, and the newer one could use more motor, so I'm breaking in a Kelly 3 hole set up with a Koford arm right now, will also try that today.

LMP is more of a problem. I've been disappointed with my new arms recently purchased, so last night I put a Koford Competitor in one of the new Cahoza T5 set ups and it sounded scarey on the analyzer. Again....will test that today.

Finally, the new Horky was incredible. I put a Valiko 22t24.5 in the tall set up, used 3/32" axle with the new Cahoza carbon fiber hubs. I don't know which ingredient worked, but right out of the box it ran 3.1s and the tires were wagon wheels, I was about .040" under the rear end. Right now I am going to throw the 455 tall single mag set up in the older Horky and try that...today also....better go now, heading over to Home Depot to get tire glue.

Slotcar Racer
02-21-2011, 12:28 PM
Home from work today being one of those damned collective bargaining employees with all the holidays and causing all the budget problems for the State of California. Oh yeah, but pretty cool we helped Jerry Brown so much and he is going to be on our side. Oops, Slotcar Racer delved into politics...very bad....will stop now. I was going to drive up to Slot Car Raceway, Rohnert Park, Calif., site of the 2006 & 2008 USRA Scale Nats, but they were closed so I stayed home and worked on the parts I already had. I did some semi finished tire work on the 28 pairs I built last week, all the 3/32" magnesium hubs are trimmed down to .700" and those Cahoza carbon fiber hubs are down to .680".

I did go ahead and convert my first Horky chassis back to 3/32" rear bearings. It was a little tedious because it had 2mm flanged bearings in the rear uprights which meant the holes were a little too big. That necessitated the use of jig wheels and alignment of the rear axle. It turned out well, so I just polished up the chassis using the usual Fast Orange hand pumice and tooth brush, then oiled it and put it away in a baggy. I won't be able to use it for three weeks anyway, next week being a warm up on Saturday for the NORCAL race which is the following Saturday March 5th.

The Scale Nats is coming up fast, just over a month away. Better go stir the spaghetti sauce now....

Zippity
02-21-2011, 12:45 PM
George,

A question.

How do you get all those "raw" tyres onto your Hudy for trimming?

Do you glue the donuts onto each "weenie/stubby" and then let them dry and unscrew them from the individual "stubbies" before remounting them on the Hudy abor?

I am confused at your procedure - which I think I am going to like :)

KVAN
02-21-2011, 01:20 PM
Happy Holiday Slot Car Racer,

I ran across some mounted speedshop tires on .900 hubs I didn't realize I still had. They might be good for practice and such as I am not sure of their age, but I seem to remember you mentioning some time back about cutting yours down to .815 and wondered if you cut off the excess from the inside or out.

Also I wanted to thank you for that Horky pan adjustment tip. I used it this weekend on my Open12 chassis and was able to run the tires down and actually drag the center section. Easily got a couple more heats from a set of tires.

If you have time could you please take a look and give me your thoughts on a post I made in Slot Car Talk regarding my scoring problem at the Masters.

Glad to hear you will be making it to the Scale Nats in April, I hope you will be bringing your side kick with you.

Slotcar Racer
02-21-2011, 05:28 PM
Hi Kevin,

Are those Speedshop .900s with the 2mm or 3/32" hole? If 2mm, my preference is to first make the outside of the hub and the inner hub flush. Then, trim the outside of the hub down to .815 or whatever you'd like. On the other hand, if they are 3/32", then do the hubs have an inset inner hub like the Speedshop 815 wides? I think if they are the older 3/32" axle .900s then just replicate the regular hubs. Going back to the 2mm, my favorite 800 wides were converted from 900 wides, and like I said, I do not like them with an inset inner hub. More consistent on fast tire changes in terms of maintaining the overall car width.

As for your computer issue, I was sort of puzzled by that. Were you robbed of laps by the computer? This is a drag for any slotcar racer. I do not have any experience with that software. When I was a Slotcar Track Owner I just used SRT and it was always perfect. See ya in April. I think Sidekick Tire Maker will be along too.

Slotcar Racer
02-21-2011, 05:35 PM
Zipp:

George,

A question.

How do you get all those "raw" tyres onto your Hudy for trimming?

S.R.: I trim each wheel individually. The raw donuts get rough cut by the Proformance HOGGER....I take them down to within .020" of final desired diameter.

Zipp: Do you glue the donuts onto each "weenie/stubby" and then let them dry and unscrew them from the individual "stubbies" before remounting them on the Hudy abor?

S.R.: That's right, you have the idea. The "weenie/stubbys" are just 1 1/2" long axles....I make them out of piano wire and polish them a bit so the hub fits nicely....this way you can make a box full of those "weenie/stubbys". I let the donuts dry at least a few days, then use a .047" drill to drill a hole through to the set screw, then I can unscrew the hub from the axle.

Zipp: I am confused at your procedure - which I think I am going to like :)

S.R.: Well, I hope the above explanations helped, if you have any more questions, fire away. And yes, you are going to like making tires. I thought you made tires already....

Zippity
02-21-2011, 07:06 PM
And yes, you are going to like making tires. I thought you made tires already....


I do, but I use lots of old axles and or piano wire, but in 2 1/4" lenghts :)

Slotcar Racer
02-24-2011, 09:41 AM
Slotcar Racer Today, yesterday and the day before yesterday.....Tuesday went up to SCR and worked on 16D stuff. I don't know why I'm doing this when the USRA Scale Nats is in just over a month....but, the NORCAL race is in Modesto on the 5th, so I'd like to be halfway competitive. A lot of racers seem to like the Brazilian 16D set ups with the D2 angle tip magnets, but I am preferring the Pro Slot set up as it seems to have a better airgap. I prefer slotcars with brakes. Looks like I will run the old RJR .560" arm in the Truck, that arm now in a new PS set up. Lots of brakes for the big brick. The 4" car has a ballistic PS motor that I blueprinted....has a PS arm. For the NASCAR race at SCR on Tuesday night, I pulled that good motor and put in something sort of interesting. It was a Brazilian can/endbell with the Pro Slot FX magnets. Gave me about a .583" hole and I had an old PS 42 degree arm in .518" diameter. The airgap was massive, and it lacked brakes, but sure went nicely down the straightaway, and great torque curve for the turns. SCR's King track is an older Ogilvie which is more of a driver's track. Unfortunately with so much less brakes, my straightaway was 5 feet shorter than everyone else's!! Interesting experiment. I might try it once more but straighten out my Cahoza springs, maybe to as much as 180 degrees and see if that gives enough brakes. Gotta go...

Slotcar Racer
02-25-2011, 01:15 PM
I'm so bummed out about Rob that I couldn't look at any slotcar stuff yesterday.

Ken Swanson
02-25-2011, 01:34 PM
I'm so bummed out about Rob that I couldn't look at any slotcar stuff yesterday.

Sounds like he was very well liked and respected by everyone who knew him. Tragic loss. I'll keep his wife and family in my prayers.

GearBear
02-25-2011, 01:55 PM
Thanks Ken. He was a great friend and we will all miss him terribly.


I'm so bummed out about Rob that I couldn't look at any slotcar stuff yesterday.

I know exactly what you mean George! I feel the same way.

Slotcar Racer
02-26-2011, 09:24 AM
Last night I installed my new BOW 16D arm, just arrived in the mail. Many thanks to Monty for fast forwarding that job, I didn't know if I would have it today for testing in Modesto. I decided to put it in the old faithful Brazilian set up with the D2 angle tip magnets, Frank just zapped em. Gave it a new pair of Bigfoot IIs and Cahoza brushes, broke it in and then installed into the NASCAR. I run a Cheetah 11 thin center section, heavy pans. Decided to try something with gearing, just to start with. The Hillclimb at Modesto is pretty short, so I am going to try an 11T pinion and a 40T spur instead of 12:44. The chassis is jigged for 44T gears because NORCAL still has a minimum tire rule of .750" unlike USRA which eliminated that antique a while ago.

Heading out to Modesto this morning at 11am after an appointment in Oakland. Hermanator is meeting me down there and we're driving out together. From Oakland it's about 80 miles, roughly twice the drive to Frank's. Last night filled up the green Camry hybrid with something like 13.8 gallons of gas and paid $51.80....Yeah, that's $3.74 per gallon, thanks a bunch Colonel Khadafy. Hey, he's only a Colonel too, at least Eisenhower had been a General, like Grant, Washington, did I miss anyone? Anyway, we'll get out to Modesto just after noon and test our stuff for next week.

Slotcar Racer
02-27-2011, 10:21 AM
Got out to Modesto at 12:39 after stopping to pick up a tuna sandwich at Mr. Pickles in Tracy, CA. Walked in and saw Howard working on a controller, then saw a purple box and set up next to it, my friend CRASH CODGER. Bought a three hour track card for $20, a good buy, and proceeded to testing on orange on the Hillclimb. The NASCAR had the new BOW arm in the Kelly set up and was really stout, but I would have liked more brakes. Turned a 4.92 which is probably not spectacular, but serviceable for a race. One thing to keep in mind about racing, it is very possible to have a car that is too fast and the closing rate will get you in trouble during the race. We've seen this happen over and over with fast qualifiers going down in flames with eight cars on the track. Better to have a competitive car that is driveable, then race to the front.

The 4.5" Brick was another matter, I could hit the bank full punch, but needed to brake right before coming out of it or the rear end would just kick out around the black and purple drivers panel on the right side, and it would deslot. Kind of a drag I can't punch it all the way to the deadman in front of the blue panel, but that was how it worked. I tried different tires and some rear weights, it didn't help. I think it might just be the chassis and the massive truck body which doesn't handle worth a damn.

The next 15 minutes was on the Corkscrew on yellow. The track felt a lot more familiar this time. I was happy with my LMP with a Koford Competitor arm in one of the new Cahoza set ups, this one honed to .530", a little tighter than usual, but a .518" arm. This one turned 3.6s on yellow, so I put it away. I seem to remember that was a competitive time, and the car drove really well. Next I put the 2009 Bulldog on with the other new Cahoza set up. It felt a bit soft, but I could do 3.4s easily and consistently. Also tried a USRA legal GT12, the Tazer with Audi R10, Cahoza set up with the PS .540" arm from the Worlds Production car. It turned 3.4s also, but had a ton of motor. Not sure about running a Tazer with an R10.....it runs great with a high downforce body, but not sure the lower downforce is as good....may have to go back to the Bulldog....more on that later for Nats preparation.

Next, back to the pit space and take out all the tools and proceed with game plan. Pulled motor out of NASCAR and replaced with the all Pro Slot motor. Changed tires on the truck and added weight. Pulled motor out of GT12 and replaced with a Kelly three hole with Koford magnets, then ready to test again. The hillclimb was, by now, full of rentals and casual users which was great to see for this new raceway. I went to the Corkscrew, this time on blue. The different motor in the GT12 seemed faster, but it was not as smooth. I came to the conclusion that the Cahoza set ups are best for scale racing. The Kelly is also good, but just not as smooth and driveable. Next I pulled out the Horky eurosport and was pleasantly surprised that the Corkscrew is now familiar enough that this type of car seemed viable to race. Got it down to consistent 3.0s, but there was a lot of traffic and I didn't want to smack some C Can car.

I waited until 3:30 to get back out on the Hillclimb and took my chances on blue with a lot of kids on the track. It actually worked out fine. The Pro Slot motor in the 16D also did a 4.92! But, I liked the brakes. The changes to the Brick did no good, it still launches out of the bank. It's gonna be a weird race next Saturday!!

So, last night I pulled the arm out of the Kelly three hole motor, it's a better arm. I opened up the airgap on the Cahoza set up all the way to .535" for the GT12 and put in the better arm. Pretty much same thing for the NASCAR plan...pulled the BOW arm and swapped it into the Pro Slot set up for more brakes. I just need to bullet proof things for Saturday and I'll be ready.

Waiting for three new PK arms and a couple of new Camen eurosport set ups. After the NORCAL race next Saturday, it's only a month to the Scale Nats.

Monty@B.O.W.
02-27-2011, 11:43 AM
George,

Just for the record, I won't use taper tip magnets even if you put flame to my feet. Try the arm in an FX setup, it will stop better. It should GO beter too...

Slotcar Racer
02-27-2011, 01:57 PM
Thanks for the verification on that one Monty! Yeah, this morning I pulled that new arm out of the Kelly set up and put it in the nice FX set up. It sounds very good on the Wright Way, so I have a 12 tooth on it and it's bolted firmly into the Cheetah 11 up against a 44T angle spur. Thanks also for setting the record straight on the angle tips, I have never gotten enough brakes out of that set up....ALMOST enough after zapping it....but I like to have braking reserve. OK, I better glue up some more tires. CRASH CODGER suggested trying some small hubs on The Brick to try to keep the rear end in check.

Monty@B.O.W.
02-27-2011, 04:53 PM
George,

Hate to make more work for you, but keep that 11 tooth open as an option. 12/44 is usually good for King length tracks. Last time I saw the Chico hillclimb it was a bit rough, 'course, that was IN Chico. I can't remember what gears Radisich ran, but he was dialed in.

oldweirdherald
02-27-2011, 06:35 PM
Is it the former Chico Hillclimb that's in Modesto? Somehow I had thought I read before that it was the one from Foster's in Santa Maria.

I raced on the Chico Hillclimb at the first 2 Chico 6 hour enduro races... what a blast! Even with though it had the different donut and was mirror image from the Hillclimb at WSSH, Matt, Neal, & really felt like home on that track. It really drove so much like our old home track in West Seattle, it was a lot of fun.

I vaguely remember the Foster's Hillclimb, as I visited there once, but the race that night was on the Paperclip. I think the Foster's Hillclimb was much longer then the Chico one. If so... that would effect gear ratio choice.

Anyway - I am just curious and wanted to verify which Hillclimb it is. I'd love to see some pics of the Modesto tracks and raceway.

BillyBob
02-27-2011, 06:59 PM
I'd love to see some pics of the Modesto tracks and raceway.

http://www.slotcartalk.com/slotcartalk/showthread.php?30124-TNT-Raceway-in-Modesto-CA

Monty@B.O.W.
02-27-2011, 08:33 PM
PK,

At 110' and no donut, sure looks like Chico. The Foster's track (still in place AFAIK) is about 150'.

Mic Byrd
02-28-2011, 09:18 AM
Slotcar Racer
Question about tazer.What effect would floating body mounts have versus fixed with regards to bite

Slotcar Racer
02-28-2011, 09:20 AM
George,

Hate to make more work for you, but keep that 11 tooth open as an option. 12/44 is usually good for King length tracks. Last time I saw the Chico hillclimb it was a bit rough, 'course, that was IN Chico. I can't remember what gears Radisich ran, but he was dialed in.

Allright my friend, I will put the 11 tooth back on the lump....besides it ran well that way on Saturday....not sure what my thinking was with going to 12:44, maybe you could say there wasn't any thinking involved, just doing! Haaa haaaa. You know more about these fishing weights than I do. My main concern for Saturday is The Brick...CRASH CODGER gave me a hint that his guys got the thing to hook up coming out of the bank by using small hub tires...so, I glued up some Pirahnas on a pair of .400" and also a pair of Kelly pencil hub rims....will true down to .795" tomorrow. Better go now...

Slotcar Racer
02-28-2011, 09:32 AM
Slotcar Racer
Question about tazer.What effect would floating body mounts have versus fixed with regards to bite

Hey Mic, I have found in general that less movement translates into tighter handling. Think of a Womp, no movement. How to get it to handle? Look for the best tires with just the right amount of slippage, but not too much. A very thin line, no adjustment with this example. Now to a chassis like the Stinger, the Tazer, Slick 7 ASP IV and the old Speedshop eurosport (plus others I'm sure) with minimal chassis movement vis a vis hinges, pans, etc...these depend mostly on the flex of the chassis. These chassis all do best with the addition of floating pin tubes, just that little added movement of the body versus the chassis gives you that little bit of "forgiveness" to keep it from being too tight. Symptoms of too tight: chattering, helicoptering off the track on to the floor, hooking up too much then letting go and cartwheeling. Too tight gives you spectacular single car wrecking with fast cars. Of course, the other main variable is the correct motor with the right amount of torque for the chassis, but that is a much more difficult road to follow, much more time consuming and expensive. Chassis adjustments such as floating tubes give you quick results when looking for a handling change.

Mic Byrd
02-28-2011, 09:49 AM
Slotcar Racer
Thanks for the fast reply and the insight. The reason I asked is a few of us have the tazers now and I built mine with solid pin tubes and alittle per load in the spine and a buddy had his built by Lou Pirro and his has floating pin tubes with no per load in the spine.His chassis is way tighter then mine so trying to figure out an adjustment for him to loosen it up a bit . raced mine yesterday and a few of the racers said mine was the best car on the track now if only I could drive it better LOL

Slotcar Racer
03-01-2011, 09:20 AM
Mic, sounds like you have the right setup for your track. The cool thing about the Tazer is you can even put short floating tubes on the rear mounts, he provided two brackets for each rear body mount. Great design by Richard Mack! One experiment I need to try is a eurosport motor in a Tazer. I have tried this already in a Bulldog and it ran 3.3s on our local track. A good eurosport will do 3.0s, so not far off.

Didn't get much done last night except true down some tires too small....good work. Actually, they are supposed to be .790" minimum and they are exactly that, but will probably have to soak in lighter fluid for tech. Better go now...

oldweirdherald
03-02-2011, 07:31 AM
PK,

At 110' and no donut, sure looks like Chico. The Foster's track (still in place AFAIK) is about 150'.

Not to keep dwelling on the the Modesto Hillclimb... since it would now be a bit off-topic here... I posted pics of the Chico Hillclimb on the Modesto thread back here:

http://www.oldweirdherald.com/gallery/main.php?g2_view=core.DownloadItem&g2_itemId=11431&g2_serialNumber=2

At least I think I cleared up my suspicions that the Modesto Hillclimb is indeed a different track then the former Chico Hillclimb. :)

I now return you to the Slotcar Racer program... already in progress. :p

PK

Slotcar Racer
03-02-2011, 09:29 AM
Slotcar Racer does not know where the Modesto Hillclimb came from. Slotcar Racer only knows that a 4.5" Brick will deslot coming out of the bank of said Hillclimb. So, last night I put on a pair of .400" hub tires Piranha donuts hoping for more grip....in fact, I got this clue from CRASH CODGER who said the Fresnoids were using the small hubs. Unfortunately, I found one of the bad magnesium hubs in the process....got the rear width all spaced with washers and was tightening the opposite to gear wheel and....ugh...it stripped. Upon closer inspection I saw it was one of the hubs where the set screw hole is too close to the edge of the inner boss and therefore weak. We just sent a bunch of these back to the manufacturer as returns, but this one got away from me. So, this morning I had to glue up a few more pairs of this hub/donut combo.

Also changed the gearing on the 4" NASCAR and on the 4.5" Brick following Monty's advice. The NASCAR now has 11:44 in 72 pitch. I couldn't find an 11tooth pinion for the Brick, but I did find a good 64 pitch gear set 10:40 for it. Nice FAAS angled pinion. Now both cars have 4:1 gearing which should be perfect for this Modesto/Chico/Fosters Hillclimb. Better go now..."work"...

Slotcar Racer
03-03-2011, 09:56 AM
Looks like a pretty easy day at "work" today....only two days to the next NORCAL race, then it's time to store those lumps and get ready for The Nats in Chicago. So last night I pretty much finished preparing the four cars for Saturday, new braid, new tires, checked tech, made sure all motors securely soldered in with adequate bracing. Full safety checks. Everything looks good. Show up, hook up, GO.

Mic Byrd
03-03-2011, 04:18 PM
Slotcar Racer
Tested the tazer last night on The red lighting Jerry Herbert's track at the Race Place. Showed a lot of promise need ALU hub tires and a little ride height adjustment and it should be pure .One question do you trim the body's for the front wing ?Again thanks for your Help.

Slotcar Racer
03-03-2011, 04:23 PM
Slotcar Racer
Tested the tazer last night on The red lighting Jerry Herbert's track at the Race Place. Showed a lot of promise need ALU hub tires and a little ride height adjustment and it should be pure .One question do you trim the body's for the front wing ?Again thanks for your Help.

Hello Mic Byrd, sounds like a promising chassis. Front clearance should be pretty much nil. Body should be trimmed for side to side movement, trim it for the front winglets and I also trim the area under the front body mount so it does not hang up there either. Keep us posted on the Tazer progress Mic.

Slotcar Racer
03-04-2011, 09:27 AM
Pretty much ready for NORCAL tomorrow. I got the final two pairs of Brick (truck) tires finished off and balanced. Before going to The Worlds I would have thought balancing tires for a 16D race would be over the top, but you know, it really does make a difference in how smooth the car runs. Got a shipment of body shells, mostly Audi R10s, both long and short version, and now starting to do the interiors on them. This is probably one of the more tedious exercises in slotcar racing. After the interiors comes the masking. On LMP slotcar bodies, I've been masking the rear winglets so that they end up being clear plastic. I've been with the Speedshop School of Aerodynamics by leaving the rear of the body in full, not cutting it off somehow. I've tried cutting it off and the car really loosens up a lot. That may have been a smart idea for the Worlds in October when the track was too tight....wish I had thought of it then....gotta get going here....

"Dub" Wade
03-04-2011, 12:26 PM
Just had to say this is a great thread. Read it every day.
Is it difficult to balance wheels?

mazur50
03-04-2011, 12:37 PM
I think this thread needs it own forum.

It is that cool.

Zippity
03-04-2011, 12:45 PM
And lots of photographs to better show us ignoramuses "how to" do it :) :)

Slotcar Racer
03-04-2011, 12:49 PM
Thanks for the positive thoughts guys...glad this is good reading and helpful. Dustyn, the balancing is pretty easy, it is static balanced using a balancer I got from Dave Harvey in the UK. Actually, there's an ebay auction for one of these from ABSLOT. The main problem I had was the axle I got with the balancer was a throw away item. Static balancing depends on the tips of the shaft being a sharp CONCENTRIC point. The axle that came with it was way off of being concentric, not even close. I had Numarc make me a couple of axles, a 2mm and a 3/32". He's our local machinist. I recommend going to your local friendly machinist to have new axles ground for this balancer. Also, I balance the whole wheel and tire once it has been trued to size, and being sure there is no dirt, glue, rubber dust etc. Then, I just cut pieces of blue masking tape about 3/16" wide, maybe 1/2" long and stick the tape on the inside of the hub opposite the heavy point. You will not be looking for perfection, but even adding a little ballast helps offset the weight of the set screw. Also, if you use the short hollow set screws (I get mine from Alpha) you don't need as much ballast.

KVAN
03-04-2011, 02:15 PM
I couldn't agree more with Dustyn and Mike, this is the best read on the blog. Who ever this "Slotcar Racer" dude is, I sure hope Mom is sharing some of the wealth!

Slotcar Racer
03-04-2011, 02:25 PM
Stay tuned for race results from NORCAL on Saturday.

Also, coming soon is discussion of "2MM" drill blanks, bearings, wheels and motor shafts. Interesting research out by Hermanator.