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Thread: Sealed Tape for the sealed deathstar 16D's

  1. #16
    Join Date
    Oct 2003
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    PORTLAND, OREGON
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    38

    Kinko's

    Some time back I recall a thread that delt with somebody having gone to Kinko's and having them made and then they rebuilt the motors and sold them on ebay as sealed motors. As I recall R.H. was his initials.
    I for one do not like the idea of sealed motor classes, the concept provides a false sence that you have the same chance as the next guy of getting a good or not so good motor but deeper pockets almost always prevail being able to buy more motors to get a good one and selling off the rest on ebay or whatever. The only way to run a legetimate sealed motor race event is to have the motors turned in to the owner after every race, then placed into plastic eggs so no one can see the motors, then at the start of every race after a racer picks their egg the race director marks the motor so that it can't be replaced and then after it is installed at tech it is verified that the motor is legal.
    I can speak from experence that being called a cheater win your not is no fun and after all fun is what slotcar racing should be all about. It is unfortunate that just a few cheaters can spoil the fun for the rest of us.

  2. #17
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    Jun 2002
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    4,471

    What? Ron Herrera is a cheat??

    Quote Originally Posted by KRAKSHOT
    Some time back I recall a thread that delt with somebody having gone to Kinko's and having them made and then they rebuilt the motors and sold them on ebay as sealed motors. As I recall R.H. was his initials.

    Man, I hope you got your armoured pants on
    Zippity

    "Rules are written by FEAR; and that Racers are motivated by the Fear that somebody may have something that gives others an Edge." - Rocky Russo



  3. #18
    Grandi Racing Guest
    [QUOTE=KRAKSHOT]Some time back I recall a thread that delt with somebody having gone to Kinko's and having them made and then they rebuilt the motors and sold them on ebay as sealed motors. As I recall R.H. was his initials.


    I remember seeing those too. It was Ron Hershman, wasnt it?

  4. #19
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    Jun 2002
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    Quote Originally Posted by KRAKSHOT
    Some time back I recall a thread that delt with somebody having gone to Kinko's and having them made and then they rebuilt the motors and sold them on ebay as sealed motors. As I recall R.H. was his initials.
    I for one do not like the idea of sealed motor classes, the concept provides a false sence that you have the same chance as the next guy of getting a good or not so good motor but deeper pockets almost always prevail being able to buy more motors to get a good one and selling off the rest on ebay or whatever. The only way to run a legetimate sealed motor race event is to have the motors turned in to the owner after every race, then placed into plastic eggs so no one can see the motors, then at the start of every race after a racer picks their egg the race director marks the motor so that it can't be replaced and then after it is installed at tech it is verified that the motor is legal.
    I can speak from experience that being called a cheater win your not is no fun and after all fun is what slotcar racing should be all about. It is unfortunate that just a few cheaters can spoil the fun for the rest of us.
    OK just to make clear to all of you, yes we do take seals off motors, do work and put them back on.

    Just shows how much of a joke the seals are. I am not the only one in this world to do this. Many racers out there do this.

    NO I never went to Kinko's or anywhere else to duplicate the seals. There is no need to duplicate the seal, just re-use it.

    You are right about the "mis representation" the seals and sealed motors try to offer. A foil seal does not make all motors equal in performance. A foil seal does not make the motor "tamper proof" nor make the seal "tamper proof" as some ads may lead you to believe. Once again, the seals are a joke. This has already been proven to an attorney and never heard from that attorney on the subject afterwards.

    Now you may ask why we offer a service..... well some racers are tired of racing against and getting beat by others that already know how to do this. As Barney Fife once said... " you fight fire with fire". If I build a illegal motor per customer specifications and he chooses to use it when it is against the rules, he is the one doing the cheating, not I. Go buy a gun, kill someone and then try to blame the guy who sold you the gun for doing the killing. It doesn't work that way.

    The only way to ever insure everyone in the field has a un opened motor, is to have all entrants buy their motors at tech time, install them in their cars and then race and next race, but another motor or all entrants pull a motor from a "box or bag" install them, race them and return them after the race to the box or bag. Anything else you will just be fooling yourself. Once the motor leaves the raceway, only God knows what was done to it and trying to prove it is another nightmare. You expect honesty in sealed motor racing??? Remember, there is no honor among thieves.

    Same goes for FK/Falcon/Cheeta motors.

    Flame on boys!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
    Last edited by Ron Hershman; 09-10-2007 at 04:28 PM.
    "When you have them by the balls, their hearts and minds will follow"

  5. #20
    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Posts
    77
    Is not winning so unbearable, that you are willing to lower yourself to cheat, or outspend the other guy? Doesn't any of you get it? Its YOUR COMPANY that should be the most important thing. You should worry more about being a fun guy to race against, and less about total domination.

  6. #21
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    Feb 2006
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    bolingbrook illinois
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    207
    yea what he said!! YEA YEA!
    I'm a sexy beast

  7. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by stick2
    Is not winning so unbearable, that you are willing to lower yourself to cheat, or outspend the other guy? Doesn't any of you get it? Its YOUR COMPANY that should be the most important thing. You should worry more about being a fun guy to race against, and less about total domination.
    Well if your referring to my racing and my company, I do not race in sealed motor classes, UNLESS the motors are handed out at the race. I rather race this way knowing that either I had the same chance of pulling a good motor or a bad motor as the other guy next to me. It's only fair that we had the same chance while it's unfair that all the motors weren't equal to begin with. If the racing allows for sealed motors to leave the raceway, then I want no part of that type of racing. Rest assured that if you don't wish to lower yourself to cheat, some other guy will be.

    I don't worry about racing anymore..... I choose to race when I want to race and race within the rules that are the same for everyone else in the room. If I out build or out drive the rest of the competition, I don't want to hear any bellyaching about spending money doing it. It's not about total domination, it's about racing, winning and having fun doing it. Anyone representing a company can be fun to race against, that doesn't mean that anyone else is going to go out and buy that racers/companies product. My last race was the ISRA Nats... I won Group 10 and Production B classes. I didn't dominate, my cars weren't half a second faster than the all of the others, I didn't spend a ton of money, I just drove a good race and had some luck on my side. There were others that could have won, but didn't have the luck or best of drives on that given day.

    It doesn't take lots of money or equipment to win races...... I would like to think that my experience over the years is what helps me win races.

    Cheating is " to violate rules deliberately"

    Experience is "the accumulation of knowledge or skill that results in direct participation in events or activities"
    "When you have them by the balls, their hearts and minds will follow"

  8. #23
    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Posts
    77
    Riddle me this than Ron. I have a good friend that I race with, and when he races a handout race, where you are extremely limited to what you can do, he is known to be a threat to win. I've raced with him for almost 30 years, and he knows his slot cars. He always does well, and when everyone is obeying the rules, you know he's going to be a front runner, if not the race leader almost all of the time. There are some times when we have raced in a class designed to be very competitive, yet for some reason, the same couple or three guys seem to consistantly run ahead of him. Its kind of like racing against a big pink elephant, but nobody wants to say anything. We also have the yoda of all racing that can take just about anything you throw at him and beat you like a red headed step child, but I digress. I've never mind getting beat by him, or yoda, and when the sun for some reason shines on my behind and I beat them, I rejoice in it. Everyone knows who's cheating, and just because they are, it doesn't make it right for you. Nobody respects the Barry Bonds of the world.

  9. #24
    Join Date
    Jun 2002
    Location
    Pine, AZ
    Posts
    649

    Seals

    Quote Originally Posted by Ron Hershman
    Well if your referring to my racing and my company, I do not race in sealed motor classes, UNLESS the motors are handed out at the race. I rather race this way knowing that either I had the same chance of pulling a good motor or a bad motor as the other guy next to me. It's only fair that we had the same chance while it's unfair that all the motors weren't equal to begin with. If the racing allows for sealed motors to leave the raceway, then I want no part of that type of racing. Rest assured that if you don't wish to lower yourself to cheat, some other guy will be.

    I don't worry about racing anymore..... I choose to race when I want to race and race within the rules that are the same for everyone else in the room. If I out build or out drive the rest of the competition, I don't want to hear any bellyaching about spending money doing it. It's not about total domination, it's about racing, winning and having fun doing it. Anyone representing a company can be fun to race against, that doesn't mean that anyone else is going to go out and buy that racers/companies product. My last race was the ISRA Nats... I won Group 10 and Production B classes. I didn't dominate, my cars weren't half a second faster than the all of the others, I didn't spend a ton of money, I just drove a good race and had some luck on my side. There were others that could have won, but didn't have the luck or best of drives on that given day.

    It doesn't take lots of money or equipment to win races...... I would like to think that my experience over the years is what helps me win races.

    Cheating is " to violate rules deliberately"

    Experience is "the accumulation of knowledge or skill that results in direct participation in events or activities"

    If your raceway wants to continue racing with sealed motors, then they should be purchased at your local raceway the night of the race, with a list of names who purchased the motors, and the motors should be engraved with the date of the race, this should happen every week. If the raceway doesn't follow this protol call then rest assured that racers will cheat. There are plenty of racers and blue-printers out there that know how to cheat with sealed motors. If you have an unexperienced racers getting beat-up every week at the local raceway, they have two options. The first option is to quit. The second option is to pay a company like Fast Ones, or another blue printer to get a faster motor to compete at his local raceway. Now is that fast ones, or any other blue printers, fault NO they are in business to make money.

    We were at the ISRA Nat's this year and Ron Hershman, did win Group 10 and B Production. Like Ron said there were other racers that were faster, in both classes but Ron's cars handled so well on every lane in both races, (Great chassie set-up and tire selection). We had a great time racing with Ron H. as-well has the other racers who attended.

    That was just my two cents.

    Steve Forsyth
    Southern California
    Last edited by Forsyth Racing; 09-10-2007 at 10:52 PM.
    ParmaPSE
    3rd Eye Technology

  10. #25
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    Jun 2002
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    Quote Originally Posted by stick2
    Riddle me this than Ron. I have a good friend that I race with, and when he races a handout race, where you are extremely limited to what you can do, he is known to be a threat to win. I've raced with him for almost 30 years, and he knows his slot cars. He always does well, and when everyone is obeying the rules, you know he's going to be a front runner, if not the race leader almost all of the time. There are some times when we have raced in a class designed to be very competitive, yet for some reason, the same couple or three guys seem to consistantly run ahead of him. Its kind of like racing against a big pink elephant, but nobody wants to say anything. We also have the yoda of all racing that can take just about anything you throw at him and beat you like a red headed step child, but I digress. I've never mind getting beat by him, or yoda, and when the sun for some reason shines on my behind and I beat them, I rejoice in it. Everyone knows who's cheating, and just because they are, it doesn't make it right for you. Nobody respects the Barry Bonds of the world.
    It's not what you got, but what you do with it.

    I would say this guy you describe is probably a good to great driver, but maybe not the best when it comes to building restricted motors/cars/etc within the rules, while the other three or so may excel at this. Just because a guy is good when all is equal in regards to a hand out race and then gets beat by a few others were building is allowed, doesn't mean the other three are cheating. Cheating is something that has to be proven and without tearing down ones equipment and checking then it's just hear-say by a few poor losers.

    If you think the others are cheating, then prove it to yourself and the others. If you don't want to partake in this, then don't accuse the others of cheating until they are proven to be cheating. Just because a guy claims to be cheating doesn't mean he is cheating either. Talk is cheap.

    I have beaten many a cheater in my day and when the cheaters thought I was cheating to beat their cheating a$$es, they tore me down and found nothing wrong and I was not cheating. I have protested a few in my day and they were all found to be cheating.

    Barry Bonds....LOL...have they ever proven he was cheating yet? I am pretty sure if they could prove it he would have been long gone by now. Barry fits in that time frame where steroids were allowed and he may have been taking them then...it was perfectly legal to do so then. Now it's not. So if they can prove he still is or did during the steroid ban, then by all means he is a cheater. Is McGuire a cheater??? In my book, NO, as steroids were allowed while he was playing and there was no penalty for it at the time.
    "When you have them by the balls, their hearts and minds will follow"

  11. #26
    Join Date
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    "When you have them by the balls, their hearts and minds will follow"

  12. #27
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    Jun 2002
    Location
    Pine, AZ
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    Cheating

    Wing-Car-Nut,

    That is a harsh acquisition towards somebody. I guess before I was to accuse somebody of cheating. I would take a good hard look at his car and to check the items listed below.

    1. How does the car handle.
    2. Check the gearing on the car.
    3. Note the type of chassie.
    4. See what type of body he is using and how it is mounted (Mounted back or mounted forward, is it pined or does he use ckips).
    5. What type of tires.
    6. Is the owner a good driver, (If he owns the raceway I would think he gets alot of practice on the track when he is closed).
    7. How much faster is the car?????? if it is only a few tenths then I don't think he is cheating.
    8. What are the rules, what can you do to the motor change the brushes, align the brush hoods.

    Answer these questions first. Then I will give you my answer.

    Steve Forsyth
    Last edited by Forsyth Racing; 09-10-2007 at 07:11 PM.
    ParmaPSE
    3rd Eye Technology

  13. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wing-Car-Nut
    I can name you two here in Ohio. You think I'm kidding or making a false accusation? You're Naive.

    M.
    Would B-E-A-R be one of them? LOL
    "When you have them by the balls, their hearts and minds will follow"

  14. #29
    Join Date
    Jan 2005
    Location
    Ohio
    Posts
    109
    Quote Originally Posted by Ron Hershman
    Would B-E-A-R be one of them? LOL
    Ron thats great, I think your on to something.

  15. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by raceslot
    Ron thats great, I think your on to something.
    Would the other one be F-R-A-N-K???? LOL
    "When you have them by the balls, their hearts and minds will follow"

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