.

.

Thread: Slot Car Racer Today

  1. #436
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Location
    Richmond, CA
    Posts
    1,279
    Quote Originally Posted by mazur50 View Post
    The arms will just not last as long. Part of the cost of running Eurosport.
    I guess I'm having trouble figuring out what's wrong with just using the Valiko arms? Those things are bullet proof. Absolutely impeccable balance, comms start around .215" diameter and give up around .194" so you get a gazillion com cuts on each arm. I'm giving the PKs a good try, but I sure didn't like what the expanded stacks did to my favorite Camen .480" tall single mag set up : ( They are sent out to be ground down to .480", when I get em back, I'll load em up again and off to SCR for a few hundred laps on each arm. We'll see what they do then.

  2. #437
    Join Date
    Jun 2002
    Posts
    625
    Quote Originally Posted by Slotcar Racer View Post
    OK, one more photo, this time it shows a 1/32 Eurosport tire. I'm happy with this, it was easy to buzz this batch of tires down to .650" right after using the R GEO gizmo. Good work Rick!
    [IMG]DSCN4090[/IMG]
    WTG George, I think you have solved it. I will change proflie on the rest of the attachments.

    BTW, I was using it on the other side of the tire. And one could also move it around to the front edge of the Hudy and cut width.
    Why make it tougher than it really is?
    e-mail: scrgeo@comcast.net

  3. #438
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Location
    Everett, Wa.
    Posts
    520
    That's even better - one pass does it!
    Guy Middleton
    Everything I was taught in Engineering school I had already learned from slot cars....

  4. #439
    Join Date
    Jun 2007
    Posts
    179
    If you guys are interested, I have a series of videos of the ISRA worlds including a video of Horky preparing his F1 car posted on Google Video. Search for "BSCRA" not "slot cars" and you will find them. I am psoting this as google are deleting all videos within the next week or so. Thereafter you won't be able to see them.
    Pat

  5. #440
    Join Date
    May 2003
    Location
    Great Valley,NY
    Posts
    1,227
    Most of this stuff is over my head tech wise, but I really enjoy reading this thread. When I grow up I want to race flat track....

  6. #441
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Location
    New Jersey
    Posts
    401
    SR,

    Great job on the needle for the R-Geo tire core widget!
    The Race Place raceplaceinfo.com
    Bowskateer founding member #3
    Get a 3rd EYE Fetroller 2.1
    Balanced by Bill

  7. #442
    Join Date
    Jun 2002
    Posts
    332
    George.

    Now you have it. For whatever your don't build yourself pick the best product on the market and develop your program around it. That's why I have been using Valicko arms for the last three years. They may cost a little more but they are well worth it.

  8. #443
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Location
    Richmond, CA
    Posts
    1,279
    Finally got some momentum going last night on the Mack 1/24 F1 chassis. As with all Mack chassis, this one is going together very nicely. You just have to do prep work with diamond tools to remove burrs making sure the parts fit together without having to squash them together. I need to figure out what to use for front wheels on this one...need to recheck ISRA Nats rules for the specs. I think the Mack takes 1/16" front axle. The H&R takes a 3/32" axle, so I think I have always used perhaps some Sonic fronts for that one. It'll take some research. Better get to "work"

  9. #444
    Join Date
    May 2003
    Posts
    60
    Lee,

    How about you not taking cheap shots at PK Armatures anymore? You are just steamed because I will no longer sell them to you. I nailed you, dead to rights, trashing them on a public forum in the past. As a result of that, I made it clear to you that your comments were not appreciated. This lead to my decision to no longer give you direct access to PK armatures.

    Once again, here you are blowing off about how bad you think they are.

    That may not be the case. I base this on simply reading the tech sheets of a few of the most recent important Scale races held in the United States. This information, posted for all to see, makes it clear that PK armatures can't be all that bad.

    2011 USRA Division II Nationals 1/32 Sports winner.

    2011 USRA Division II Nationals 1/24 Sports winner.

    2010 ISRA World Championships 1/32 F1 winner.

    2010 ISRA World Championships 1/24 Sports winner.

    The last win noted was the event that had 7 of 8 of the Worlds' finest EuroSport Scale racers, in the main event, running PK armatures. You remember that race. The one that Greg Gilbert, who I consider to be an exceptional driver, had some sort of mechanical problem. Because of that, Greg lost out, on what may have been a very high finish, at a World Championship event. As they say, bad things can happen. Greg was in good form, having won 1/32 Sports, no doubt, running a Valiko armature. His finish in 1/24 Sports must have really hurt him. I must admit, when Greg had his trouble, I had no worry about who would win the race. How could I, with the other 7 drivers all running PK armatures?

    I am very clear on the fact that PK armatures are certainly not any sort of magic bullet by any means. They are only one part of a slotcar. There are so many other factors that make a car great. The armature alone could certainly never be the reason.

    My feeling is one of being very grateful, to all the racers, who choose to run PK armatures, while learning to work around the short comings of them. Because of this, I do consider myself to be rather fortunate.

    For now, I suggest that the American racers take a lesson from the European racers. Run your new PK Scale arms for the first time and then have the stacks reground to make the armature round again. If all the European racers, that run PK armatures, are doing this, as a matter of normal service work, then so should others. The European racers, as well as a few forward thinking American racers, are willing to do this and suggest to me that it is fine with them. Their reason is that they would rather have the softer .007" lamination material used in PK Scale armatures, than have stronger, less magnetic, .014" material.

    This was made very clear at the 2010 ISRA Worlds and at the 2011 USRA Division II Nationals.

    As a footnote, there are other armature manufacturers, already putting out good products, that I worry about, much more than Valiko.

    Have a nice day, Lee.

    Dan Miller

  10. #445
    Join Date
    Jun 2002
    Location
    Fall City, WA
    Posts
    1,364
    Dan,

    While what you say is interesting. From my own personal standpoint, I can't afford to run an armature that only lasts 4 laps very often. Three months ago I purchased a 95 arm from Al Chuck and put it in a brand new Camen "small block" setup (.480 arm, .490 hole). I was very hopeful that it would be a rocket as in the past when I ran your stuff that was my experience. And in fact the arm was a replacement for one I had used so much I finally wore thru the comm. The motor sounded great on the power supply at 4 volts so I was very happy. 4 laps after putting the car on the track the Stack expanded on one of the lams taking out 1/4 of the rear magnet and locking up the motor. I hadn't even started to push the car yet as the tires were not up to temperature and the car was pretty loose on the track. Oh, and the lam that expanded was 3 or 4 lams away from the nearest balancing hole. So we can't blame it on that.

    So, how am I supposed to feel about your arms? It used to be that they were the best. Period! Now, I am not so sure. When I was racing 10 years ago, we would all jump on the shipments from you and get what we could. I never once had an issue like this. Since I had a couple of your arms from back then I raced them in my setup's. When I went to the new small block format on the motors I again wanted to use your arms. I was warned that they had issues with the stacks blowing but bought one anyway. Then the first one I purchased blew a stack. $150 down the drain in 4 laps. I never even got a chance to do as the Europeans and grind the stack after the arm had been warmed up as the arm didn't last long enough to do that!

    So, I'm here to tell you that you have a problem. Spending nearly $100 on an arm that MAY blow a stack VS spending $115 on an arm that you know is going to work well and be bulletproof is a pretty easy decision for me. I would gladly run your arms as I like the power curve better on the ones I used to run over the power curve on the motors I had at the Nats (all Valiko BTW due to the issue with the above arm). But unless I can be assured you have tried to solve the problem of the expanding stack issue, I just can't fork over money on arms that have a very poor track record right now.

    As for the arm that Paul ran at the Nats, he told me it was an older one that had proven itself to be a great arm and he had won races in the past with it. The question I didn't ask was how many he had to go through to find one that stayed together.
    Gary Johnson

  11. #446
    Join Date
    May 2003
    Posts
    60
    Gary,

    In the near future, I will offer both .007" and .014" laminations on my armatures. The newer gear ratios, using 6 tooth pinions, have proven to be a problem for the thinner .007" material.

    As I mentioned, the normal thing now is to regrind the arms round again. I have said, to many racers, that I would change over to the .014" and was met with a great deal of resistance.

    The simple solution is to offer both .007" and .014". I will advise when this takes place.

    Dan Miller

    .

  12. #447
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Location
    Richmond, CA
    Posts
    1,279
    People, please stop this now or I'll have Mom lock this thread forever. I started this thread back in January just as a place for me to write down what I am currently working on with my slotcars, and that includes some of my thinking processes. By no means do I want to favor any products, I am not a sponsored racer and I have no allegiance to any manufacturer....I just buy stuff, put it together (often incorrectly, by the way) and try it out. I am so sorry that Dan had to appear on this thread to respond to Lee. Let me just say that I have used Valiko arms exclusively up until now. Currently, as of today, Friday April 22, 2011, my PK arms are sent out for stack grinding (touch up) and I am excited to get them back so I can try them again. (Please refer to post #436). I am not orthodox religious towards any particular products. I am also ordering some bigger hones to try wider airgaps to go with the larger .485" diameter of Dan's armatures. Please, please, please, no more bickering. Just write about what you did with your tire wrench at the workbench last night!

  13. #448
    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Posts
    564
    Not trying to stir the pot and maybe this should have it's own thread but....... with Dan offering advice..... and I'm trying to learn..... and keep Slot Car Racers thread positive & instructional.

    Do wing racers run .007 or .014?

    Do motors on a flat track turn more RPM than a wing car?

    What motors run hotter wing or scale?

    What about a .010 lam?

    What and how does the .007 vs the .014 arm differ in performance? RPM? Driveability? Brakes? Power curve? And anything else that I mised?

    What thickness lams are others using?
    Why do I do this to myself?

  14. #449
    Join Date
    Jun 2002
    Location
    fairfield ca.
    Posts
    339
    gary, did you have the stacks ground after you got them from al? all of the arms i have recieved from al have been .485 . .490 seems very tight for a possible .485 dia arm. (just an observation)

    Quote Originally Posted by GearBear View Post
    Dan,

    While what you say is interesting. From my own personal standpoint, I can't afford to run an armature that only lasts 4 laps very often. Three months ago I purchased a 95 arm from Al Chuck and put it in a brand new Camen "small block" setup (.480 arm, .490 hole). I was very hopeful that it would be a rocket as in the past when I ran your stuff that was my experience. And in fact the arm was a replacement for one I had used so much I finally wore thru the comm. The motor sounded great on the power supply at 4 volts so I was very happy. 4 laps after putting the car on the track the Stack expanded on one of the lams taking out 1/4 of the rear magnet and locking up the motor. I hadn't even started to push the car yet as the tires were not up to temperature and the car was pretty loose on the track. Oh, and the lam that expanded was 3 or 4 lams away from the nearest balancing hole. So we can't blame it on that.

    So, how am I supposed to feel about your arms? It used to be that they were the best. Period! Now, I am not so sure. When I was racing 10 years ago, we would all jump on the shipments from you and get what we could. I never once had an issue like this. Since I had a couple of your arms from back then I raced them in my setup's. When I went to the new small block format on the motors I again wanted to use your arms. I was warned that they had issues with the stacks blowing but bought one anyway. Then the first one I purchased blew a stack. $150 down the drain in 4 laps. I never even got a chance to do as the Europeans and grind the stack after the arm had been warmed up as the arm didn't last long enough to do that!

    So, I'm here to tell you that you have a problem. Spending nearly $100 on an arm that MAY blow a stack VS spending $115 on an arm that you know is going to work well and be bulletproof is a pretty easy decision for me. I would gladly run your arms as I like the power curve better on the ones I used to run over the power curve on the motors I had at the Nats (all Valiko BTW due to the issue with the above arm). But unless I can be assured you have tried to solve the problem of the expanding stack issue, I just can't fork over money on arms that have a very poor track record right now.

    As for the arm that Paul ran at the Nats, he told me it was an older one that had proven itself to be a great arm and he had won races in the past with it. The question I didn't ask was how many he had to go through to find one that stayed together.

  15. #450
    Join Date
    Jun 2002
    Location
    Fall City, WA
    Posts
    1,364
    Dan,

    Thanks for the status update on the thicker lams. Please let me know when you have them ready. As I stated, I always felt your arms were the best in the past. I was truly disapointed when I had the issue with my latest one! BTW, since we have your ear, can you explain the difference we will feel between an arm wound on the two different thicknesses of laminations? Also, is there maybe something in between that would have similar characteristics to each?

    George, sorry for the interuption to your awesome thread! I am like you. I don't have any affiliation with mfg's. This is actually why I responded to Dan. I would rather let him know how I felt. I am very happy that he might have a solution for us. I could care less about his issues with Lee. I know how Lee can be
    Gary Johnson

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •