Am 4.5" NASCAR on the G-12 King

[Scale Series]

Hmm, Winged 4.5" Nascar......New class?

I think that was suggested by "Crazymoron" 5-6 years ago? Maybe it was winged Pro Mod's or something like that? Oh, well

[backintheslot]

Yep, or something like that.................................Full Punch!

[Ron Hershman]

Sorry Ron I missed this chidding by you. For your information I do consider myself an Expert racer and motor builder on a budget. In fact after a 5 year layoff I came back into racing Gp12 and was racing in the amateur class when several of my fellow Mid-Atlantic racers embarassed my for not running the Expert/Pro GP12 class. So now that's where I race. You on the other hand have won several IRRA R4 events and when I have complained about you racing the motors you rebuild ,when no one else has that opportunity ,I get lambaised for insinuating that there is any wrongdoing. I get told that you win because you are an "exceptional driver with a slower motor". So when were you an amateur last???? Dates please!!!

When did you move back up to the Expert ranks Freddie??? Was this after your 8th place finish in the Am LMP class at the 2010 USRA Scale Nats on April 12, 2010 or before that date?

The last time I was an amateur??? I guess April 9, 2011.

[Scale Series]

The last time I was an amateur??? I guess April 9, 2011.

LOL you're too funny

[Jeff714]

The last time I was an amateur??? I guess April 9, 2011.

Now that was funny!!!

[Fast Freddie]

I raced in the Am LMP because I had never raced on a flat track ever. I only raced Am in Div II because I have never won a national event and I'm not sponsored and the last time I raced Div II was in 1991 over 20 years ago. I guess I qualified for AM. I race Expert/Semi Pro in Div I. You would have got that if you had read the whole post. Try again, I'll wait.

When did you move back up to the Expert ranks Freddie??? Was this after your 8th place finish in the Am LMP class at the 2010 USRA Scale Nats on April 12, 2010 or before that date?

The last time I was an amateur??? I guess April 9, 2011.

[Joe Rocket]

so being i have only raced in 1 USRA National event am i a USRA amateur also? i have won 4 amateur AMSRA National Championships and multiple expert podium finishes.......but like everything else...it was over 5 years ago.......


I am very amazed that everyone on here are so upset about this issue at the 2011 Nats......come on people they are toy cars........i understand this is a job to some/most of you but all in all we are all grown men playing and arguing over TOY CAR RACING.

I have been involved in many other forms of racing and have never seen such a sport that has so many people crying over issues. YES maybe Ron shouldn't have run amateur, but the officials said he could run. A few years back Nascar had names for Winston cup driver that ran Busch races....BUSCH WHACKERS!!.......And now they have Kyle Busch winning just about everything. Back in the day USAC used to be a stepping stone series. Midgets, then Sprint Cars, then Silver Crown Cars, then Indy cars. Drivers had to have at least 3 wins in the lower division to be able to race the next level class. But now they could care less who runs what.

What im trying to get to is this problem has and will always happen in any and every form of racing.

I think this issue was going to happen sooner or later because of the poorly written rule and it took someone like Ron to help fix poorly stated rules for everyone.

I guess everyone just needed something to talk about sence they have nothing else to do.

[Bob Kurkowski]

There are those who side with roman polanski...

Bob K.

[oldweirdherald]

There are those who side with roman polanski...

Bob K.

And I heard that in Wing Car racing... there are even some who side with Roman K!


Sorry Roman... but this thread has already gone on too long and gotten silly... so I couldn't help myself.

I guess that one was for Doug...

[Ken Swanson]

so being i have only raced in 1 USRA National event am i a USRA amateur also? i have won 4 amateur AMSRA National Championships and multiple expert podium finishes.......but like everything else...it was over 5 years ago.......


I am very amazed that everyone on here are so upset about this issue at the 2011 Nats......come on people they are toy cars........i understand this is a job to some/most of you but all in all we are all grown men playing and arguing over TOY CAR RACING.

I have been involved in many other forms of racing and have never seen such a sport that has so many people crying over issues. YES maybe Ron shouldn't have run amateur, but the officials said he could run. A few years back Nascar had names for Winston cup driver that ran Busch races....BUSCH WHACKERS!!.......And now they have Kyle Busch winning just about everything. Back in the day USAC used to be a stepping stone series. Midgets, then Sprint Cars, then Silver Crown Cars, then Indy cars. Drivers had to have at least 3 wins in the lower division to be able to race the next level class. But now they could care less who runs what.

What im trying to get to is this problem has and will always happen in any and every form of racing.

I think this issue was going to happen sooner or later because of the poorly written rule and it took someone like Ron to help fix poorly stated rules for everyone.

I guess everyone just needed something to talk about sence they have nothing else to do.

Wow, where to begin?

First off according to the USRA's rules, if you haven't won an amature event at a USRA sanctioned race you are eligible to run amature or expert. AMSRA event results have no bearing here.

NASCAR comparisons also have no bearing but to your argument, there are no rules that prevent "Busch Wacking". Nor are here any similar rules in the other forms of racing you mentioned.

The point (and the reason everyone is so upset here) is that there are very clear rules that should have prevented the ridiculous situation at the 2011 USRA Nats.
They were clearly ignored by Ron and several other racers. Then to add insult to injury they were further ignored by the USRA race officials.

2011 USRA Rule Book

(page 49)

I. Driver Classification Scale Division
A. Eurosport and GT-12
All drivers are encouraged to enter these classes regardless of ranking.
B. Driver Divisions
All classes except Eurosport and Junior will be divided into Amateur and Expert divisions.
1. Amateur Division
a) Racers with average driving or technical ability and newer racers. (Ron Hershman..........No)
b) At the National Championships, Amateur Division racers will use handout motors for all classes.
c) Junior class is for those 14 years of age and younger.
2. Expert Division
a) All drivers with exceptional driving or technical ability. (Ron Hershman..........Yes)
b) Any driver sponsored by a major manufacturer must race in this Division. (Ron Hershman..........Yes)
c) Any racer who has won in any Amateur class at the Scale Nationals must race Expert Division in all classes at any future Nats. (OK, so wouldn't it just go with out saying that any driver who has won in any expert class (Ron Hershman - multiple times) must race Expert Division in all classes at any future Nats.)

All the rules BS aside, in what possible galaxy would Ron Hershman even remotely be considered an "amateur"?

The bottom line here is really very simple:

A. Ron had no business running amateur anything.

B. The USRA officials had no business allowing it.

[Joe Rocket]

Wow, where to begin?

First off according to the USRA's rules, if you haven't won an amature event at a USRA sanctioned race you are eligible to run amature or expert. AMSRA event results have no bearing here.

NASCAR comparisons also have no bearing but to your argument, there are no rules that prevent "Busch Wacking". Nor are here any similar rules in the other forms of racing you mentioned.

The point (and the reason everyone is so upset here) is that there are very clear rules that should have prevented the ridiculous situation at the 2011 USRA Nats.
They were clearly ignored by Ron and several other racers. Then to add insult to injury they were further ignored by the USRA race officials.

2011 USRA Rule Book

(page 49)

I. Driver Classification Scale Division
A. Eurosport and GT-12
All drivers are encouraged to enter these classes regardless of ranking.
B. Driver Divisions
All classes except Eurosport and Junior will be divided into Amateur and Expert divisions.
1. Amateur Division
a) Racers with average driving or technical ability and newer racers. (Ron Hershman..........No)
b) At the National Championships, Amateur Division racers will use handout motors for all classes.
c) Junior class is for those 14 years of age and younger.
2. Expert Division
a) All drivers with exceptional driving or technical ability. (Ron Hershman..........Yes)
b) Any driver sponsored by a major manufacturer must race in this Division. (Ron Hershman..........Yes)
c) Any racer who has won in any Amateur class at the Scale Nationals must race Expert Division in all classes at any future Nats. (OK, so wouldn't it just go with out saying that any driver who has won in any expert class (Ron Hershman - multiple times) must race Expert Division in all classes at any future Nats.)

All the rules BS aside, in what possible galaxy would Ron Hershman even remotely be considered an "amateur"?

The bottom line here is really very simple:

A. Ron had no business running amateur anything.

B. The USRA officials had no business allowing it.

i assume most of you DO NOT have a facebook to blog on.........Maybe.....JUST maybe all the other amateur races should have grabbed the bull by the horns boycotted the rest of the NATS when they noticed the issue instead of running home and venting on here about it.....(maybe im just to smart for toy car racing).......

Yes maybe he shouldnt have run amateur but he did and probably had just as much fun as the rest of the people in the building.

[Joe Rocket]

(Ron Hershman..........Yes)[/COLOR]
]

He is the OWNER of a major manufacturer. So technically he is a self sponsored racer like the rest of the amateurs there.....so I'm assuming Jeg Coughlin( the owner of JEGS) would be considered sponsored by a major manufacturer and would have to run EXPERT and any and all USRA NAT's? here is my point on that statement, the rule should really state," Any Driver sponsored by OR OWNER of a major SLOT CAR manufacturer must race in the expert division"

ok ok Back to Facebook for me.....by by

[oldweirdherald]

OK... this is getting extremely redundant now. Anything that could be said on this has now been said numerous times.

If anyone thinks they still have something original to add to the topic... just scroll up a ways and I'm pretty sure you could find that it has already been said.

Besides, the discussion regarding the USRA Rules, and their interpretation and enforcement, has now been going on in a seperate thread, which has now been moved to the USRA Forum.

Way past time to lock up this thread.

PK