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Thread: Wing Nats at something other then a Gerding speedbowl.

  1. #121
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    Dec 2009
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fast Freddie View Post
    Don't you dare say that. No drive on 95 from down here could even remotely be considered "short". Agonizing, yes, but never short.
    It's not bad if you leave at 4:00 am

  2. #122
    Join Date
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    Home of the 2007 USRA Nats and a pretty fast King Track
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fast Freddie View Post
    Don't you dare say that. No drive on 95 from down here could even remotely be considered "short". Agonizing, yes, but never short.
    It's all in the timing....;-)
    There are "Racers" and there are "Talkers".....which one are you?

  3. #123
    Join Date
    Feb 2005
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    3,395
    Quote Originally Posted by RomanK View Post
    Mike, your story of volunteering reads well many years later, but one only needs to go back and look at the results to see that you were eliminated in the Semi thus were required to turn marshal the main, which you did admirably other than your head explosion that caused me to hold up the Pro Main at the Nats while I calmed you down.
    I thought I got eliminated in the Consi.

    I figured out I actually made the Semi and edited out the Consi part in an hour (actually 61 minutes)

    The point was instead of grabbing an easy turn, and watching the race, or taking the Deadman for one heat, and getting up at the end and saying "Somebody else's turn",I took the hardest turn and stayed there for 8
    heats.

    Here's some of Mom's rhetoric from the race.

    What a heat! There was actually a point where it appeared to be a track call, but all 8 cars were off with the power still on!

    Following was a track call to get something out of the slot in Beuf's lane on Purple. An atmosphere of general mayhem ensued for a minute while everything got sorted out!

    Did I mention intensity???


    Intensity went up a bit, and tempers flared. Whoever had Swiss in the betting pool for losing his cool in the 3rd heat would have won - if Mike was driving, but he was marshalling.

    Everything settled down with Mike cracking jokes and marshalling with lightning speed again and the race goes on...


    The "all 8 cars off thing" should be a hint of what was going on.

    You had probably 7 of the best 9 or 10 G7 racers in the World, in that Main, and it was mayhem, especially in the Deadman.

    When he was on Red, I marshaled Mario every lap for over a minute straight, at the start of the heat.

    The point of my post to Hesketh was that running on a track with a flaw wasn't going to help the attendance.

    Even though I never mentioned your name, you took it personal and turned it into "Ha, ha, you didn't make the Main".

    Everyone that ran on that track, especially the guys who ran faster cars, knew that the Deadman was screwed up.

    I remember being at a previous race and having one of your local racers assuring us that you guys were trying to figure out what was going on in the Deadman.

    I will say that I never remember seeing anything obvious that would of caused the problem.

    PS- On a positive note, I just looked and noticed this is the busiest I've seen OWH in quite awhile.
    Last edited by swiss; 08-25-2015 at 08:50 AM.
    "Get Yourself Retrofied"
    Chicagoland Raceway
    17B West Ogden Ave.
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    Check out Chicagoland Raceway on facebook.

  4. #124
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    Jun 2002
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    I started this thread to discuss a possible alternative to helping draw back some wing racers, it's wasn't to bash wings, in fact thats all I race or ever will race. If they finally go the way of the dinosaur I won't be switching to retro or flexi's. As a result I do think alot about what might bring wing racers back or get new ones in. I'm currently working on how to start a regular program at Rapid Raceway, certainly not a typical wing track . I do think the development of wing racing down the current narrow track has pushed out many racers. I think Larry mentioned that there weren't enough nonGerding tracks to consider the idea, when you consider how many Gerdings are left itmight be a push. Dallas is now gone, not sure when Doug will have another Nats, BP doesn't have any wing racing anymore, Tracy's track will be an add, but we aren't rolling in Gerdings appropriate for a Nats. For non Gerdings, you have Frank Sarkela, the Engleman at Speedzone NJ (arguably a better choice then their Gerding), the Purple Mile at Modelville, Paul Pfeiffer's King, Rogers Hillclimb at MidWest, there are probably others but these come to mind off the top of my head. Maybe another alternative is for the USRA to sanction a Retro Wing Nats, to be raced at a Non Gerding track, with commercial availabilty rules suspended, and a limited selection of classes like the old days, say G12, I15, G27, Open, so it's shorter length and a maximum hubsize of .500 diameter. Not as a substitution for current wing cars, just as an alternative for those that want to race wings but don't live near a Gerding and can't afford 24.00 tires every 3 heats.
    MON THE BIFF !!!

  5. #125
    Join Date
    Dec 2003
    Location
    Michigan
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    663
    You're welcome MOM. Who needs facebook???
    Skidmarks
    230 S. Averill
    Flint, Mi 48506

  6. #126
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    Apr 2003
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    OLNEY MD.
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    468
    im posting just to say i was involved but Roman? in 2003 the Warm up races were insane people flew in from washington state just to test on the track i remember NO sleep
    When will you guys ever get your car to go around YFS

  7. #127
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    Jul 2013
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    Central, Illinois
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    325
    Quote Originally Posted by hesketh View Post
    I started this thread to discuss a possible alternative to helping draw back some wing racers, it's wasn't to bash wings, in fact thats all I race or ever will race. If they finally go the way of the dinosaur I won't be switching to retro or flexi's. As a result I do think alot about what might bring wing racers back or get new ones in. I'm currently working on how to start a regular program at Rapid Raceway, certainly not a typical wing track . I do think the development of wing racing down the current narrow track has pushed out many racers. I think Larry mentioned that there weren't enough nonGerding tracks to consider the idea, when you consider how many Gerdings are left itmight be a push. Dallas is now gone, not sure when Doug will have another Nats, BP doesn't have any wing racing anymore, Tracy's track will be an add, but we aren't rolling in Gerdings appropriate for a Nats. For non Gerdings, you have Frank Sarkela, the Engleman at Speedzone NJ (arguably a better choice then their Gerding), the Purple Mile at Modelville, Paul Pfeiffer's King, Rogers Hillclimb at MidWest, there are probably others but these come to mind off the top of my head. Maybe another alternative is for the USRA to sanction a Retro Wing Nats, to be raced at a Non Gerding track, with commercial availabilty rules suspended, and a limited selection of classes like the old days, say G12, I15, G27, Open, so it's shorter length and a maximum hubsize of .500 diameter. Not as a substitution for current wing cars, just as an alternative for those that want to race wings but don't live near a Gerding and can't afford 24.00 tires every 3 heats.
    At Roger's we run G12, I15, C12 & 27L Monthly. We are set to have a pretty good turn out in September. To the point of possible having more than 8 racers in a couple of classes..

    Most of us run .615 hub's. I think .500 hub may be a little too restrictive. at MINIMUM .550 hub, but I say up to .615 hub is fair. It's after .615 that the price gets out of control and you go threw tires soo fast.

    I know I would be far more likely to travel within 8 hours (Tracy's, Skidmarks, Koford) to race a bigger than local race but not something as esteemed as the NATS..

    -TheChad

  8. #128
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    Jun 2005
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    Sunny So Calif
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    655
    Tire cost is the biggest reason why people arent racing, not the track. If you can bring tires back down to $13-$14 retail, I think people will start getting back into it. If you take into consideration the cost of waffling, that would probably get the tires down to a decent price. I will admit it was probably one of the contributing factors why I didn't race Pro G7 this year.

    Why wouldn't you want to race at the nats chad?
    Last edited by 86ed once again; 08-25-2015 at 11:53 AM.
    James Grinstead

    TEAM KOFORD

    Why so serious?

  9. #129
    Join Date
    Feb 2005
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    3,395
    Absolutely right on tires.

    Running those big rim, waffled tires, so everyone can go half a tenth or a tenth faster, does not make sense.

    When I started ruining wing racing in 1995, by trying and winning with an aluminum chassis, in G27, I ran one set of Riggen orange tires the whole race.

    Of minor note, one tire measured .640", and the car absolutely fine.
    Last edited by swiss; 08-25-2015 at 12:05 PM.
    "Get Yourself Retrofied"
    Chicagoland Raceway
    17B West Ogden Ave.
    Westmont,Il. 60559
    Phone-708-203-8003
    mikeswiss86@hotmail.com

    Check out Chicagoland Raceway on facebook.

  10. #130
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    Jun 2002
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    Land of Excitement "Bensenville"
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    Cost of tires are a Big Problem that is why I retread all my tires. 500 hub in all classes no waffling. That will get the cost down. Oh wait I proposed that in 2011 at the Nats and was told that the manufactures would just raise the price of the .500 hub to $25 so they can keep up with there loss.

    Someone needs to have a talk with Stu and Skinner. $14 a tire is 100% doable I know.
    Michael Mazur
    Ruzam Racing
    Team ProSlot

  11. #131
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    There needs to be a price restriction in my opinion. Any hub as long as it retails for $14. If the manufacturers wanted they can do big hubs not drilled or waffled or .550 hubs drilled, whatever the manufacturer wants.
    James Grinstead

    TEAM KOFORD

    Why so serious?

  12. #132
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    Quote Originally Posted by 86ed once again View Post
    There needs to be a price restriction in my opinion. Any hub as long as it retails for $14. If the manufacturers wanted they can do big hubs not drilled or waffled or .550 hubs drilled, whatever the manufacturer wants.
    Problem with your solution that stops people from making there own tires. The only way you can control that is to have the tires purchased at the raceway. But then that takes the guy that can only aford to retread his own out. If you limit it to a size and a spec and a price. Then guys retreading will be ok.

    Or maybe a controller tire is the way to go then you dont have guys selling tires at the raceway that might be from a good batch for more money.
    Michael Mazur
    Ruzam Racing
    Team ProSlot

  13. #133
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    Jun 2002
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    Springfield, Il.
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    535
    .....and I remember the day when tires were $5.00/pr for mag hubs. My Nats winning car in 1999 ran one set of $5.00 Go tires the entire main.
    Jeff Bechtel/Former Int-15 World & National Champion

  14. #134
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    Jul 2003
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    Canton,Ohio
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    Quote Originally Posted by JIMSPOVE View Post
    I miss the Tri-State Series and the Midwest series .

    That says it all,don't know how good you have it till its gone.
    Remember the lack of any credible evidence is proof the conspiracy is working!

  15. #135
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    Jun 2002
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    Stratford CT
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    Jim, I agree with you about tire cost , but not necessarily about the tracks. The reason we have 4.10 long chassis and 135mm long open bodies with .650+ hub tires is completely due to the track. Those cars will not work on anything but a Gerding, they have evolved together. No one makes chassis for anything but Gerdings anymore if you try to race wings on any other type of track you need to have scrounged up 10+ year old equipment. I have a fleet of cars specifically built for the Yankee series which runs on a variety of tracks. They are old 4.55 to 4.65 long cars, A 4.10 superstiff Beuf car will not make a lap on Rapid Raceway's hillclimb. The fast tires on that track are .500 hub tires. So the tracks are fundamental to where we are in car development. On the other hand trying to race these "retro " wing cars on a Gerding would be mind numbingly boring. So that tracks work hand in hand with the style of car. Maybe obvious but it is fundamental to the issue.
    MON THE BIFF !!!

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