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View Poll Results: What is Your Favorite Track: Assuming all were available to you

Voters
10. You may not vote on this poll
  • King

    4 40.00%
  • King Cobra

    0 0%
  • Tri Oval

    0 0%
  • Oval

    0 0%
  • Hill Climb

    3 30.00%
  • Stadium/Kingleman

    1 10.00%
  • Engleman

    1 10.00%
  • Sovereign

    0 0%
  • Anaconda

    0 0%
  • Flat Track

    1 10.00%
Results 1 to 9 of 9

Thread: Favorite Track

  1. #1
    Join Date
    Jan 2014
    Location
    Spartanburg, SC
    Posts
    279

    Favorite Track

    If all of these tracks were equally available, which would you like to race?

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Nov 2012
    Location
    12 miles south of P.A.'s
    Posts
    104
    Depends on the type of car.
    Wing would be a King.
    Scale would be a Hill Climb or flat track/road course.

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Posts
    562
    King tracks have killed wing car racing & they are killing scale racing. The equipment has advanced to the point where they are simply 155 ft drag strips with to much goo on them. As driving has been replaced with better and better handling equipment people are tired of being forced to buy more and more equipment and voting by not showing up because they don't have a sharp enough knife to compete. Just the other day I was at an event and people left after the first race because they didn't have fast enough equipment. Didn't matter if the car was not light enough or the wrong body or tires that were not hard enough or they didn't buy enough "cheap motors" the point is they left, walked out, did not compete, did not pay entry fees, stated they were tired of being forced to buy new stuff and some even commented that they wanted to race "over there" on a different track where they would have to drive instead of full punch everything, etc.

    Don't get me wrong there is skill in everything and some guys are better at setup than others. But when the competition forces a person to run very light cars, in heavy glue, with hard tires and simply put motor after motor and tire after tire on to be competitive they will reach a point where they make a personal decision to not spend any more money or simply not attend. Kinda seems scale is following the same path of wings don't it?

    The other thing that I noticed was there was no lifting. If someone fell off it usually resulted in car after car hitting the pile full speed. That led to emotions running high, body's and cars getting damaged, marshals getting yelled at / blamed and sucked the fun right out of the room.

    I put a new "cheap motor" in for GTP. Seemed OK and qualified mid pack and had less than 50 laps when the race started. It went about 20 laps. Stack blew apart by one of the balance holes the chinese smoked into the stack with a dull drill bit. No fun but I still had a motel bill, gas, food, entry, equipment purchased etc...... so that took a lot of the fun out of it for me. Kinda makes the cost of the motor irrelevant don't it? I saw another guy that traveled a very, very long way & his car just stopped. Not sure of what happened but it took the fun out of it for him also.

    I think this will be another thread where we get knee jerk posts and attacked instead of well thought out logical posts.
    Why do I do this to myself?

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Jun 2002
    Posts
    1,935
    I like the American Orange named Monarch. Once they were plentiful, but today there aren't too many around. You could race scale & wing cars on them, as i have.
    I like long walks, especially when they're taken by people who annoy me.

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Jan 2014
    Location
    Spartanburg, SC
    Posts
    279
    Quote Originally Posted by Wallbasher View Post
    King tracks have killed wing car racing & they are killing scale racing. The equipment has advanced to the point where they are simply 155 ft drag strips with to much goo on them. As driving has been replaced with better and better handling equipment people are tired of being forced to buy more and more equipment and voting by not showing up because they don't have a sharp enough knife to compete. Just the other day I was at an event and people left after the first race because they didn't have fast enough equipment. Didn't matter if the car was not light enough or the wrong body or tires that were not hard enough or they didn't buy enough "cheap motors" the point is they left, walked out, did not compete, did not pay entry fees, stated they were tired of being forced to buy new stuff and some even commented that they wanted to race "over there" on a different track where they would have to drive instead of full punch everything, etc.

    Don't get me wrong there is skill in everything and some guys are better at setup than others. But when the competition forces a person to run very light cars, in heavy glue, with hard tires and simply put motor after motor and tire after tire on to be competitive they will reach a point where they make a personal decision to not spend any more money or simply not attend. Kinda seems scale is following the same path of wings don't it?

    The other thing that I noticed was there was no lifting. If someone fell off it usually resulted in car after car hitting the pile full speed. That led to emotions running high, body's and cars getting damaged, marshals getting yelled at / blamed and sucked the fun right out of the room.

    I put a new "cheap motor" in for GTP. Seemed OK and qualified mid pack and had less than 50 laps when the race started. It went about 20 laps. Stack blew apart by one of the balance holes the chinese smoked into the stack with a dull drill bit. No fun but I still had a motel bill, gas, food, entry, equipment purchased etc...... so that took a lot of the fun out of it for me. Kinda makes the cost of the motor irrelevant don't it? I saw another guy that traveled a very, very long way & his car just stopped. Not sure of what happened but it took the fun out of it for him also.

    I think this will be another thread where we get knee jerk posts and attacked instead of well thought out logical posts.
    While there are parts of this that might be vulnerable to criticism based on the driver being prepared when investing so much to travel to an event, let's not even engage that because I think there is a real issue underneath that involving competitive races and track layout. On the one hand, you want to see people embrace the hobby and by doing so they will get better and be more competitive. On the other, we have to realize those will be a very small minority and certainly not enough to keep a track open so they can't be the focus of a local track....yet they can't be neglected either. So how do we sponsor races for, let's call them intermediate racers who have invested in a body, chasis and motor and traveled to an event expecting to have a fun day of racing, and not bore or ask the more developed racers who have invested BIG bucks to throttle back and not push themselves to higher levels of racing. An event that accommodates both sounds like it might bore the advanced racer and discourage the intermediate making no one want to stay.
    Then there is the track.... I think solving the first problem of how to structure races might solve the second one. The first thing that pops in my mind is qualification running. Set a threshold for certain races that all but guarantees that intermediate and advanced racers are broken out into two different racing tiers. Of course....if only two advanced racers show up to an event then all will race together and there's your first and second place I guess. Rules are the other way to impact the race. regulating gears and motors helps level the playing field without limiting a racers ability to show his skills.

    What other ideas are there, especially related to tracks. If you dislike the King as you stated....then what tracks work better?

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Posts
    562
    Quote Originally Posted by Michael.cannonj View Post
    ....then what tracks work better?
    Tracks that you have to lift / drive. Equipment that you can't full punch, lower down force body's etc....... There is a personal skill challenge in that no matter what equipment the person has. Homologation of equipment for a set period of time in the lower / beginners class. That alone would help reduce the motor issues.
    Why do I do this to myself?

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Jan 2014
    Location
    Spartanburg, SC
    Posts
    279
    Quote Originally Posted by Wallbasher View Post
    Tracks that you have to lift / drive. Equipment that you can't full punch, lower down force body's etc....... There is a personal skill challenge in that no matter what equipment the person has. Homologation of equipment for a set period of time in the lower / beginners class. That alone would help reduce the motor issues.
    That sounds like a Hill Climb maybe. The long straight run on both a King and an Engleman allows a driver to go full throttle for half the track but then drive the rest. A Hillclimb usually gives you less time to drive all out IMO.

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Mar 2003
    Location
    Dallas, Texas
    Posts
    319
    Quote Originally Posted by Wallbasher View Post
    King tracks have killed wing car racing & they are killing scale racing. The equipment has advanced to the point where they are simply 155 ft drag strips with to much goo on them. As driving has been replaced with better and better handling equipment people are tired of being forced to buy more and more equipment and voting by not showing up because they don't have a sharp enough knife to compete. Just the other day I was at an event and people left after the first race because they didn't have fast enough equipment. Didn't matter if the car was not light enough or the wrong body or tires that were not hard enough or they didn't buy enough "cheap motors" the point is they left, walked out, did not compete, did not pay entry fees, stated they were tired of being forced to buy new stuff and some even commented that they wanted to race "over there" on a different track where they would have to drive instead of full punch everything, etc.

    Don't get me wrong there is skill in everything and some guys are better at setup than others. But when the competition forces a person to run very light cars, in heavy glue, with hard tires and simply put motor after motor and tire after tire on to be competitive they will reach a point where they make a personal decision to not spend any more money or simply not attend. Kinda seems scale is following the same path of wings don't it?

    The other thing that I noticed was there was no lifting. If someone fell off it usually resulted in car after car hitting the pile full speed. That led to emotions running high, body's and cars getting damaged, marshals getting yelled at / blamed and sucked the fun right out of the room.

    I put a new "cheap motor" in for GTP. Seemed OK and qualified mid pack and had less than 50 laps when the race started. It went about 20 laps. Stack blew apart by one of the balance holes the chinese smoked into the stack with a dull drill bit. No fun but I still had a motel bill, gas, food, entry, equipment purchased etc...... so that took a lot of the fun out of it for me. Kinda makes the cost of the motor irrelevant don't it? I saw another guy that traveled a very, very long way & his car just stopped. Not sure of what happened but it took the fun out of it for him also.

    I think this will be another thread where we get knee jerk posts and attacked instead of well thought out logical posts.
    When was the last time you wing raced??? We haven't run "heavy glue" in years. EVERYTHING is spray glue now. The only full glue racing left is PRO Group 7.

    In any form of heads up racing, it will be expensive. Slot cars, real cars, boats, airplanes, chainsaw cutting, lawn mower racing....blah, blah, blah. It is ALL expensive. There will always be guys willing to spend more than you. Sometimes you can out smart them. other times you can out drive them. Its RACING.

    I have flown 1700 miles to race the worlds pro open race just to smash the bridge in the first heat of the A quarter. Destroyed the car. We do this this for the love of the sport. We do this for the camaraderie. We do this for the dinners after the race and the bench racing that ensues. We don't do this for money.

    But, to answer the question, whatever track is available to race on, is the best track.
    "Never underestimate the predictability of stupidity"

    Archie King
    2019 TSRA Series Group 7 Champion
    2018 TSRA Series Group 7 Champion
    2018 HillBilly Box World Record Holder 1.907
    2016 HillBilly BoxStock Champion
    2014 TSRA Series Group 7 Champion

    Team KOFORD
    http://www.koford.com/slot/

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Location
    Long Island,N.Y.
    Posts
    976
    I chose a Kingleman but I would have picked "King, light banking" if given the choice. Heavily banked Kings, known as speed bowls, are my least favorite. Initially they were built to compete in a very bizarre competition. One where a raceway can declare "Fastest Track in the World". How did that work out? Pretty much killed wing racing. Now apparently it's killing scale. Not sure of the raceway but a new Gerding was built with more normal banking. That's what the owner wanted. Smart move.

    Car, tire and track design has advanced so much that the band-aids used back in the day to keep cars on the track are obsolete. Blobs of messy glue and huge oversized wings were only used because that was the quick fix to keep the heavy lead sleds on the track. The glue is almost gone now. The bodies are shrinking as is the wheel base. But they only work well on speed bowl Kings. Track specific cars.
    Don't resist....VOTE !

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